this post was submitted on 29 Dec 2023
140 points (97.3% liked)
World News
36819 readers
616 users here now
News from around the world!
Rules:
-
Please only post links to actual news sources, no tabloid sites, etc
-
No NSFW content
-
No hate speech, bigotry, propaganda, etc
founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
Come on, let's not deflect from whose to blame here. Russia is sending missiles where missiles don't belong. When Russian missiles kill Ukrainian babies in a maternity hospital, that's Russia's fault. They knew full well what they were doing.
This war could have been over months ago or never even started if it weren't for NATO encroachment and sabotaging peace talks. I'm not defending Russia here I am pointing out reality.
All this is because the west would not let eastern Ukraine exercise any self determination after couping the government in 2014.
So here's the problem with peace talks. What would Russia agree to? They currently occupy a massive chunk of pre-2014 Ukraine, something like a quarter of the country. If Ukraine agrees to that, it sends a signal to the Russian government that invading Ukraine pays. Russia already made a go at installing a puppet government in the initial 2022 invasion. Why should Ukraine trust it not to take the time following a peace agreement to regroup and invade again? And besides that, Ukraine's never going to easily give up that much territory. Imagine that happening to your own country.
Why should the people in those territories that pled for help against the coup government that was slaughtering them for 8 years not be allowed self determination?
And also as an anarchist I don't believe in any legitimacy of either state, but if the people there feel safer under the protection of the Russian federation against the clearly Nazi captured Ukraine government, who am I to tell them what to do?
You talk of Russia trying to install a puppet government but the US SUCCESSFULLY installed a puppet government run by Nazis in 2014.
This is up there with “America elected a black president so racism is over.”
lefties should do this more
"there's white people in it, it literally can't be woke"
That doesn't even make sense. A Nazi government is all or nothing, the stench of racism lingers regardless of who is at the top.
Yet somehow new photos of Ukrainian troops wearing Nazi patches still pop up in the media on a daily basis.
It DOES make sense to peoples who actually know a bit about German history and 20th century European fascism.
Nazis hate Jewish people, that’s true. But they also gladly look the other way when a Jewish person happens to be useful to them.
Search Jewish Nazi collaborator and who the Nazis gave the title « honorary aryan » to, you’d be surprised.
by this standard not even nazi germany would be a nazi government to you
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Association_of_German_National_Jews
all or nothing literally doesn't exist in nature
except in the brains of ultras
That's why you have to burn it out from the roots
People tell me the Nazis wanted to create a Greater German Reich, but Hitler was Austrian.
Oh dang we left the door open and a
wandered in. Poor little fella.
It may be helpful for you to consider this piece covering the long running problem with the far right that Ukraine has been dealing with. A cursory search would show you that this is a problem reputable news agencies have been documenting for years before the current war.
Liberal, proud of it. I'm aware of the problems Ukraine has had with its far-right. That doesn't make it a "Nazi government". Speaking of, are you aware of the problems that Russia has with its far right? Or is only a problem when it's Ukraine?
Okay sweet so you're aware of the role they're playing in the current government then. Not sure why you found that idea objectionable a minute ago but whatever.
And yes I'm aware, not a big Putler fan here. It's too bad the left is so weak in the former Soviet nations.
Personally I just hope a peace can be negotiated soon to save lives.
But if i do the reverse of this argument its whataboutism
A Jewish person being part of a Nazi government isn’t the oximoron you people are trying to paint it as.
Nazis are hypocrites who never hesitate to act contrary to their genocidal racist brain rot whenever it’s politically convenient for them to do so.
This includes the original Nazis.
If you weren’t aware, the German Nazi state had a title, so called « honorary aryan », which they gave to Nazi officials (or people useful to the Nazis in some way) of ethnicity that the Nazis would have otherwise sent to concentration camps, among the peoples who were granted the title were a number of Jews.
The title offered it’s recipient immunity to the racist policies and laws of the Nazis as well as sometimes outright favor treatment.
The title was also used to justify allying with the Japanese as well as, less famously, some middle eastern countries.
Side note but still relevant, the third reish supported Israel, since the Zionist goal of settling European Jews in Palestine aligned with the Nazi goal of riding Germany of Jews.
As for the claims about neonazis in the Ukrainian government, you just haven’t bothered to look have you?
It’s literally so easy to find outlets that couldn’t be less associated with the Russian government talking about the neo Nazi problem of Ukraine. Just search Nazi Ukraine and filter between 2014 and 2022 and you will find tons of them.