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this post was submitted on 22 Aug 2024
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My parents seem like normal somewhat rational people. They are still planning to vote for Trump. Please stop with this "we've already won" shit. It can only cost us the win. Go vote. It's far from guaranteed. It honestly looks to be pretty close to an even race right now.
That's not at all the right takeaway from his comment. The right takeaway from his comment is that Trump has every intention of winning by massively cheating, and his supporters are already inserting themselves into positions within the election system to do just that.
That is why the focus is on strong arming his party and elected officials to remind them that he led a literal fucking lynch mob against the last republican who crossed him by... not shitting on the constitution on Jan 6.
if trump wins it is not going to be by a popular vote (it was never going to be that). It is not even going to be by barely squeaking by on the electoral college. It is going to be by getting close and then using outright theft and violence to get the rest of the way.
Which is why, even if someone is too stupid to understand that there are down ballot candidates who matter just as much (arguably moreso), they still need to vote. Because we need a landslide so that there are no elected (or military...) officials who decide that they want to be on "the winning team" and defy the will of the people. And that is who trump is campaigning to at this point.
Almost half the country will vote for the orange ape. Don't other this guy's parents. If everyone voted the country wouldn't be in this situation anyway. Take 40% out of the voting pool (not even counting voter suppression) and the ill-informed will vote alongside the hyper-informed.
His parents are actively supporting a bigoted rapist who wants to destroy the country and become king.
They deserve some other-ing.
That tribal rubbish is how we got into this bullshit in the first place. We need to reach out into their community, not declare fellow Americans outlaws.
Yes, the real problem is the people who don't respect others right to... decide that people deserve to be persecuted for the color of their skin or what they have between their legs.
Fuck off with that. I someone is supporting a violent bigoted rapist then they SHOULD be a fucking outlaw.
I agree that Trump is evil. But in a democracy, people are permitted to vote how they like. That the fucking point of it. If your view prevails don't complain if the other side gets in and decides to 'other' you. You have to be fine with that, because that's what you are promoting.
I don't know if you have heard the British singer, Billy Bragg? He's quite famous as a anti-Tory lefty. Great singer too. He wrote a song called 'Full English Brexit' and it was quite compassionate about trying to understand his ideological enemies . These people are being hurt by late stage capitalism. They can be uneducated, low information and bewildered. Hucksters have been taking advantage of their weaknesses for generations. Othering them will not change their mind. Reaching out is your only hope. Harris has that capacity if she gets a chance. I'm not a huggy huggy hippie, but this problem will not go away with more hate. That's been done for nine years now and the other guys are better at mindless hate than we are.
I am not talking about othering people because they have different opinions about capital gains taxes or whether the local high school should have money to rebuild their stadium.
I am talking about a rapist who led a violent insurrection and a party who actively talks about violence against his opponents. That is not democracy. That is fascism in the making.
And people are permitted to vote how they like. Someone could get out there and run on a platform of "little boy dicks are awesome". That doesn't mean they deserve to be accepted into society because they actively are not part of society at that point.
Freedom of Speech is the right to say stuff. it is not the right to not be judged for it.
And all this "we have to meet in the middle" bullshit? Again, let's do that for socioeconomic issues. There is no fucking middle for basic human rights. Unless your idea is that trans people can only breathe every other day. And women are only allowed autonomy of their body if they can get an appointment before noon?
Your are misrepresenting my position. I am not suggesting that we "meet in the middle". I'm say that if their ideas suck, attack their ideas.
Furthermore, I understand your position and have respect for it. I was there too. We need to promote and communicate better. Harris's version will actually lift these same people, but they just don't understand that because of the GOP's and related Media's poison.
Or,just continue to go down the mindless road of hate, that seems to be working splendidly. Anyway, thanks for the discussion!
When someone has shitty ideas, you attack the ideas. And, more importantly, you explain how they would actually benefit from UBI or whatever.
When someone openly wants the extermination of a people because they were born the wrong gender or want to enslave women? When they are all but saying they want to rape their political opponent?
They don't count as people anymore. They are monsters and should be treated as such. Anything less is normalizing that. Which is exactly what we did with decades of "We have to show love to the neonazis so they can choose love" bullshit. We went from nazis being the universal evil that you can do any horrible thing to in media to needing to be careful to not portray them TOO negatively out of fear of death threats.
And also? Former neonazis don't talk about how Jamal Walker next door was so nice to them that they just had to reevaluate if replacement theory was maybe a bit wrong. They hit rock bottom. They are abandoned by their families and often have their faces eaten by leopards. And then they decide they want to be in society again and put in the effort to maybe stop calling for the eradication of others and so forth.
So, again, fuck off with that steven universe "We just have to all be friends and love each other". The moment someone's "political" beliefs descend into stealing basic human rights and enslaving others? They don't deserve to live in society anymore.
TL:DR