581
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
this post was submitted on 14 Aug 2023
581 points (95.0% liked)
Showerthoughts
30023 readers
615 users here now
A "Showerthought" is a simple term used to describe the thoughts that pop into your head while you're doing everyday things like taking a shower, driving, or just daydreaming. A showerthought should offer a unique perspective on an ordinary part of life.
Rules
- All posts must be showerthoughts
- The entire showerthought must be in the title
- Avoid politics
- 3.1) NEW RULE as of 5 Nov 2024, trying it out
- 3.2) Political posts often end up being circle jerks (not offering unique perspective) or enflaming (too much work for mods).
- 3.3) Try c/politicaldiscussion, volunteer as a mod here, or start your own community.
- Posts must be original/unique
- Adhere to Lemmy's Code of Conduct
founded 2 years ago
MODERATORS
We've seen what the Russian military has been like in Ukraine, if you think most of those subs aren't rusting piles of garbage then you're probably drinking that tankie Kool aid. They've probably had to cannibalize the majority of them just to keep what few they have running, because it's not like they just idly make parts for 1950's era subs, especially not for a country that barely has enough money to feed themselves and spends most of that on their nuclear program.
Also they're loud ass diesel subs, every modern navy will know exactly where they are and how many they have easily, and it's not like 1950's weaponry is going to make up the difference.
This being said, Russia also isn't as weak as we like to think. Given how the war has ground to a standstill, it's not unlikely it'll become yet another frozen conflict. And that's after arming the Ukrainians with large amounts of advanced weaponry.
We've become so used to the idea we'd have air supremacy in any potential war, we thought the Ukrainians would be able to push their way through the front, forgetting that the Ukrainians aren't able to take out artillery or mines beforehand.
The Russians have also adapted quite quickly. At the beginning of the war, the Ukrainians were having huge successes with drones. Now the Russians are downing 10,000 drones a month:
https://www.businessinsider.com/ukraine-losing-10000-drones-month-russia-electronic-warfare-rusi-report-2023-5?op=1&r=US&IR=T
To be clear, Russia is an existential threat to Europe. If they turn this conflict into a stalemate, they will have won territory that doesn't belong to them and it's almost certain they'll rebuild, rearm and do it again. Just like happened with Moldova, Georgia, and Ukraine in 2014.
But underestimating the Russians is not in NATO members' interests. No one ever won a war underestimating the enemy, better to give Ukraine more than they need, than just barely enough to make incremental advances under the assumption Russia won't do a second wave of conscription and/or doesn't have (or isn't building up) reserves for a (counter) counter-offensive.
And given how Ukraine has struggled, even with advanced weaponry, it's clearly high time for Europe to re-arm so that Russia doesn't mistakenly think we're weak.
Russia is in a standstill, after losing major ground constantly for a year, against a country 1/3 Ruzzia's population, Ukraine also had next to no standing army prior to the invasion, meaning they had next to no professional soldiers prior to their being invaded by Ruzzia, and Ruzzia is invading them in conjunction with two of their allied powers, Belarus and Chechnya, all while the west slow rolls the supply and training of Ukraine, think about that for a sec.
Also this enemy that they're in a standstill with has been so effective that one of Ruzzia's key armies, Wagner, chose to rebel over continuing to get fed to the meat grinder. Ruzzia is literally down to recruiting 16 and 60 yr olds right now.
All of the propaganda by both Ruzzia and the West all made it seem like Ruzzia should have easily rolled over Ukraine prior to the realities of this war. However this war exposed Ruzzia as a broken down, corrupt paper tiger with a delusional dictator at the helm.
Incorrect.
After Russia invaded in 2014, Ukraine heavily invested in its military. NATO has also been helping them train for years now. Wall Street Journal
This is also why Russia faced far stiffer resistance in 2022 than they did in 2014.
Belarus's involvement is very limited. They're mainly allowing the Russians to fire missiles from their territory. Wikipedia
Chechnya isn't a country or 'power'. It's the Russian equivalent of Alabama.
It would be a mistake to think people like Prigozhin want to end the war. Russian ultra-nationalists want to intensify and escalate the war, not stop it.
18-30. The Guardian
An actual world super power would have rolled over Ukraine in a week. The fact that they've beat the Russians back for an entire year is not only totally bad-ass and heroic, but it also exposed the Russian Army for the weakling it is. The only reason Russia is still considered a world super power is because of their stockpile of Soviet era nukes. If Russia can't take Ukraine, they have zero chance against countries like China or the US, and especially not the combined forces of the United Nations?
The really advanced US tanks and jets haven't entered the fight yet, and we've seen big gains in the last week with Russia losing 3 towns in the south, all the gains they made in the north over the last month taken back, and more groups crossing the Dnipro river. It's been a slow acceleration wearing through Russian reserves, but there's still a way to go before winter slows things down.
The real advanced weapons enter the fight next spring.
Hey there!
Looks like you had a moderate, down to earth take on the Russia-Ukraine war.
That's a down vote.
But seriously thanks for not attending to the feedback loop of propaganda and childish dick stroking.
I do get it though. Most of us want Ukraine to win. We ignore the information that we don't like. It's human.
But it's not helpful, especially when the reality sinks in that this war isn't easy, and thousands of young men are dying.
99% of what I see regarding this topic is either straight up war propaganda or people who are unabashedly unafraid to let others know that they are totally ignorant of post WW2 geo politics.
Anything other than "DAE just love Ukraine and that charismatic Zelensky! ๐๐" gets down voted to oblivion. Its classic Red Scare 1980's bullshit lol. Even now I'm sure most who read this are scrambling for the down vote button because they think I'm some sort of Russian shill/supporter simply based off the fact that I'm not fellating the West's efforts.
You're not wrong but you're not a victim either. People disagree on message boards, people are dumbasses, that's what we get for hanging out here.
I'm not sure what led you to believe that I think I'm a victim of anything other than western propaganda, something I have in common with 99.9% of Americans.