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It was only a matter of time before the Chinese started ramping up their own semiconductor capabilities. With all the inevitable industrial espionage involved, I wonder if the west really has that much of a head start in chip design.

[-] iopq@lemmy.world 40 points 1 year ago

Design? No

Fabs? The advantage is insurmountable as long as the US keeps preventing ASML from exporting EUV to China

[-] laylawashere44@lemmy.blahaj.zone 16 points 1 year ago

Making a lithography machine that's on par with ASML is just an engineering challenge. One that's been solved once already by ASML, whose to say it can't be solved again by someone else, especially if they can copy bits of the design.

[-] iopq@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago

It took them almost 20 years to make EUV machines that do it at scale. Canon and Nikon gave up on it.

They also have many suppliers like Zeiss that may not be allowed to export to China, but I'm not sure about which ones are and which ones aren't

Things can be done a lot quickly if you are given an unlimited budget. Consider how quickly NASA got from nothing to landing on the moon, vs how long it is taking now with their much more limited budget.

[-] iopq@lemmy.world 1 points 1 year ago

Yes, but it was the "next thing" since research started in like the 1980s

It's actually harder to do than landing on the moon.

[-] sndrtj@feddit.nl 9 points 1 year ago

Yeah fuck that. As a Dutch citizen it should be up to our government to decide whether we let ASML export. But no, it's got to be the Americans.

[-] besbin@lemmygrad.ml 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

that's a micron of the boot the global south are feeling daily. They have not even outright taking your stuff while forcing you to pay for the gun they pointed at your face yet

[-] iopq@lemmy.world 0 points 1 year ago

The US sold patents to ASML under the condition that they would listen. The patents are from US publicly funded universities. Invent your own tech and you can export it anywhere you want

[-] rbesfe@lemmy.ca -1 points 1 year ago

The Dutch government is ultimately making the decisions, they could remove all export restrictions if they wanted but that would really sour its relationship with the US gov't.

[-] sndrtj@feddit.nl 4 points 1 year ago

That's easier said than done when you have a proverbial gun pointed at your head https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Service-Members%27_Protection_Act

this post was submitted on 03 Sep 2023
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