Same as Ireland right?, is it really a gotcha moment to say capitalism doesn't work because sometimes it is installed under an authoritarian system, even though more so socialism is installed under a authoritarian system vast majority of the time

[–] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 6 points 5 days ago (1 children)

All states are "authoritarian," the difference is which class is the ruling class. In capitalism, that's the capitalist class, but in socialism, it's the working class. The state is simply the instrument by which the ruling class in any given society resolves class conflicts in favor of the ruling class. That's why in socialist countries, metrics for the working class have skyrocketed, but they largely stagnate or decay in capitalism.

[–] Highlandcow@feddit.uk -3 points 3 days ago (1 children)

No modern or past socialist country has had the working class as there ruling class, there has always been an elite class, this is simply not true Cuba and North Korea are instant examples that come to mind, and there are countless more

All states are authoritarian too a degree, there is nuance here and not everything is black and white

[–] Cowbee@lemmy.ml 2 points 3 days ago

Every socialist state has had the working class as the ruling class, that"s part of the definition of socialism. The state is not a class itself.

Secondly, the degree to which a state exerts its authority depends on the circumstances it's in. Nazi Germany and modern Germany both have the same capacity for weilding authority, but the Nazis came to power during economic crisis, and killed the workers that were organizing in order to prevent socialism from spreading. Modern Germany isn't any less authoritarian, it just doesn't need to exert the same degree of authority. It will eventually, most likely.