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this post was submitted on 17 Dec 2023
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We should be very careful about our labels. Just as we don't want to say all Palestinians are not Hamas. We should not say all Jews are Israel. The government and country of Israel is separate from the ethnicity and separate from the religion. Even though many people speaking on behalf of the country of Israel conflate the labels of the religion and the ethnicity we should be better.
I realize you clarify things by the end of your post, but the first sentence of your post paints with a broad brush stroke
I have faith in people like yourself to be intelligent enough to parcel what I've said.
There is a reason I started with Jews and not Israelis. It's because I'm in Canada and I've spoken to Jews in both Canada and America and the sentiment is the same. "Israel can do no wrong".
Now that said, there is a hell of a lot of nuance there which will never carry over properly in a post on Lemmy or anywhere tbh.
Yeah I had to cut being friends with someone who was aggressively pro-trans rights and pro-LGBT and super accepting. Why? Because he's Jewish and was INSISTENT that any criticism of the actions of Israel was to be antisemetic. Last I heard he's still defending them slaughtering civilians because "They're dangerous people."
It's depressing as fuck to see some people unable to seperate religion and state here.
Just illustrates how deeply we can have different principles from other people, but still agree with them on some key issues. Slowly starting to believe they see the world the same way we do. And then all the sudden we get shocked.
Sorry you had to go through losing a friend. That's rough
He wasn't a good friend to begin with. Everytime you were wrong he would do THAT smile and say "No" and then say what's true. That's aggravating enough but he would do the same to opinion. Say your opinion is wrong and explain the "correct" one with the same condescending behavior. Him being insane was just the cherry on top to make me want to leave.
I see a lot of Israeli pink washing too.
Well it's a good thing you did the work and spoke with every Jewish person in north America to be able to paint with such a broad brush. I guess all the people I've spoken with we're lying about their ethnicity.
In seriousness though, simply adding "many" or "a plurality of" is enough to add nuance to the discussion. Starting with the blanket "the Jews" isn't a good look.
Case in point on not being able to have a level headed discussion. Obviously I'm generalizing. Obviously there are those that vehemently disagree with what the state is doing. Unfortunately those aren't the ones making the decisions.
You are entitled to feel the way you do. Doesn't change what I've seen in my years.
Oh my gosh! People online have different opinions and have lived different lives with different world experiences?!
You're generalizing about an ethnic group that has historically been and currently often is the target of discrimination and violent harassment. The citizens of Israel are largely against their government and their actions, as are the Palestinian people against Hamas and their actions.
You generalizing to say the Jews are to blame is perpetuating a serious problem.
I highly recommend you watch this segment from John Oliver on the topic to understand what I mean. https://youtu.be/pJ9PKQbkJv8?si=rtyoNQuMmVPV9B9F
You do realize that there is a nation (Israel) that is generalizing everyone they kill with the same broad brush as well? The IDF themselves have stated that if innocent people die that's acceptable to them.
So yes, instead of having a discussion about what's actually happening let's nitpick on someone generalizing "the Jews". Let's completely invalidate a discussion for that reason and that reason alone.
Best of luck in life.
Don't blame the poster you're responding to for your poor word choice. The criticism you're receiving is fair. Own it, and do better.
I own what I say but other people need to own when their feels are hurt because someone says things they don't like, specifically online.
You're entitled to feel the way you do too, but it doesn't change what I've seen in my years, either.
I think I'm being perfectly level headed, I'm just being a little snarky. At least equally snarky to your comment.
I just wanted to point out that nuance is possible with just a few additional words, but only if we choose to use nuance.