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TIL personal credit scores only started in 1989
(en.m.wikipedia.org)
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this post was submitted on 21 Feb 2024
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It’s our version of China’s social credit score.
Except we don't get the free housing and tuition, the cheap and efficient mass transit, or the retirement at age 55.
Not even close 🤣 what an absurd thing to say. You really think following social rules is the same thing as participating and having a financial history of posting back lent money is the same thing?
Edit you know what, never mind I see you all trying to compare imaginary insurance Facebook scenarios and pretending like that's how a FICO works. 👌👍.
When I was younger, I was denied housing because I had no credit rating. Not a bad rating mind you, but no rating at all, because I did not use credit cards or anything else that would get me in Experian's system. I was penalized for never accruing debt. The system is absurd.
Similar with immigrants. We brought a guy over as a software engineer. He was very well paid, stable family life, etc …… and could not buy a car because no credit history, had a difficult time finding an apartment because no credit history
If you ask someone to loan you some money (a line of credit), they might reply:
"Hmm, has anyone else loaned you money before, and you paid it back, showing you can be responsible with a loan?"
Even if it's just a friend asking for you to spot them $50, you might ask a mutual friend if that person actually pays them back.
It makes sense that not having a credit history is negative for them.
Sure but this person was denied housing because of their lack of credit. Some jobs will also deny you for similar reasons.
You need to think about this a little harder.
The landlords are there to make money and not to offer charity.
They aren’t going to take a risk offering you housing if they feel strongly that they’ll never see a dime from you.
It’s not a hard concept to understand.
I won’t invite you into my house if I think chances are good you’re going to rob me.
There are numerous other ways to determine that like eviction records, references, or reported income. A poor score doesn't mean that you aren't going to pay rent and most rentals require a first and last month's rent to begin with.
Do you think someone who pays all their bills but was the victim of identity theft should be unable to access housing?
If you’re homeless without a job, why would I take a risk? You’re not thinking about it from the perspective of a creditor.
No. But if I were a creditor why would I take a risk on you just because there is a possibility you’re a victim of identify theft?
If the world was ran with your expectations all businesses would be broke because they would be exploited into oblivion.
For every victim of identify theft out there there’s 10 other people happy to take advantage of the situation and never pay a dime.
You’re purely thinking from the perspective of a victim and clearly don’t see that all of this is a liability. It’s not up to a bank or landlord to provide charity.
Do you invest in anything? Would you invest into a stock, a company, or anything if there is information that clearly indicates a small chance on a return of investment? The answer is no. Instead you’ll invest in something else that is proven to be a good return. It’s simply risk management vs opportunity cost.
Statements like this make me think you've never actually had to rent an apartment/home before or you'd have realized there's an application process involved before you're accepted. This is basic knowledge.
Nobody is talking about charity, stocks, creditors, or any of the other strawman b/s you're spouting. Somehow, people managed to rent homes/apartments long before credit scores or the internet existed, but for some reason, you don't seem to think that's possible while also lacking basic information on the process like mentioned above or standard first and last month deposits as mentioned in my previous comment.
Restricting someone from credit due to poor financial decisions makes sense. Restricting someone from housing because of some score that comes out of a black box is abhorrent.
Part of the application process generally entails a credit score check. This is also basic knowledge.
You can argue all day long but in the end landlords and creditors look at a poor credit score as a risk to their investment. Nothing more.
Statements like this show me you’ve never owned a business, never been a landlord, or otherwise been in a position where risk management is at play.
There is no grand evil conspiracy here, you just don’t understand risk management and how it relates to credit scores.
This right here shows me you know virtually nothing about what a credit score is or how it’s calculated.
Ah so you’re making strawman arguments while accusing me of making strawman arguments.
Clearly I am talking to someone that has zero ability to understand basic finances while simultaneously lacking basic communication skills. Obviously I am wasting my time responding to you.
Good bye.
You're just exemplifying the inherent problem.
People need housing. People without a house are a risk. People with houses won't let people that need housing rent a house because of said risk. Thus we are back at the start where people need housing but can't get it because of the broken system.
You can talk about risk management until you're blue in the face but it doesn't change the fact that landlords are participating in a broken system that leaves real people in one of the worst situations you can be in.
In Europe this still doesn't even really exists. You just bring your proof of capital/value/timely payment stubs to the bank.
Germany has SCHUFA. Fairly similar to credit reports. Pretty much necessary to successfully rent an apartment (in Berlin at least).
Though, there isn’t the expectation that you have accrued debt in order to have a good score, like in the US.
Seconded. If you dont have your SCHUFA, proof of employment, and original Mona Lisa, you'll never get an apartment in Berlin
Oh, in America you still have to provide those things too, AND have a decent credit score.
Omg...
The last few times I've applied for credit I've only had to self-report my income and not dig out paystubs. I'm honestly not sure if I should be worried or happy
Most of America doesn't have credit scores
Yes it's really the same thing. A basic number to reflect how good of a citizen you are. The metrics used are irrelevant
Exactly. The number is a score of how profitable you are to the system which in the US profitable is the only metric anyone cares about. Seems the same just seems like the difference is the societal preference.
It's not even how profitable you are. A million dollars in the bank and no debt is worse than 0 net worth, up to your eyeballs in debt, but making all the payments.
That's just it. Your mil sitting in a bank is not their profit yet.
There's no such thing as "China's social credit score". All of thar came from small local projects and miss translating articles.
Edit: https://youtu.be/Kqov6F00KMc for the 10000 people whose just today are learning about it.
Your social score has increased to: 🌟🌟🌟🌟
Thank you for your continued support in defense of this system. Your alliegance has been noted.
But what does Mr. Translating have to say about the situation?
He can't be arsed to care at all, frankly.
That is not true. I have had Chinese friends tell me that for example you cannot fly on a plane if your social score is too low.
He gave you any proof, or just told you? Care to share it?
If any other random person wrote an article, would you believe them more?
The guy that have been doing videos on geopolitics and China for years or the friend of the guy on lemmy?
Also: https://merics.org/en/comment/chinas-social-credit-score-untangling-myth-reality
Are you sure it's 10,000? That sounds like a lot.
The 10,000 part is a reference to this XKCD comic