this post was submitted on 19 Sep 2025
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Fediverse

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Call me crazy, but I a) think the fediverse probably doesn't have more 'toxic content', harmful and violent content, and child sexual abuse material then other platforms like X, Facebook, Meta, YouTube etc, and b) actively like the fediverse because of that.

But after a few hours carefully drafting and sourcing an edit to make it clear that no, the fediverse isn't unusual in social media circles for having a lot of toxic content, I realised that the entire 'fediverse bad' section was added by 1 editor in 2 days. And the editor has made an awful lot of edits on pages all themed around porn (hundreds of edits on the pages of porn stars), suicide, mass killings, mass shootings, Jews, torture techniques, conspiracy theories, child abuse, various forms of sexual and other exploitation, 'zoosadism', and then pages with titles like 'bad monkey' that seemed reasonably innocent until I actually clicked on them to see what they were and, well.

I decided to stop using the internet for a while.

I've learned my lesson trying to change Wikipedia edits written by people like that - they tend to have a tight social circle of people who can make the internet a very unpleasant place for anyone suggesting maybe claims like 'an opinion poll indicated that most people in Britain would prefer to live next to a sewage plant than a Muslim' should maybe not on Wikipedia on the thin evidence of paywalled link from a Geocities page written by, apparently, a putrid cesspit personified.

I thought I'd learned my lesson about trusting Wikipedia.

It just makes me so angry that most people's main source of information on the fediverse contains a massive chunk written solely by a guy who spends most of his time making minor grammar edits to pages about school shootings, collections of pages about black people who were sexually assaulted and murdered, etc, and that these people control the narrative on Wikipedia by means of ensuring any polite critics' are overcome with the urge to spend the rest of the day showering and disinfecting everything.

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[–] HubertManne@piefed.social 1 points 1 day ago

Just wanted to bring up that when its one person and recent you can do a revision to revert to where it was and give a reason why that editor is griefing. Did it a few times on an article of a book called intelligence of dogs and some person took the article to be its about the intelligence of dog breeds (I mean it was in the context of the book and study done) and would change the list. I would revert with a link to what the book had and a comment that the article is about a book and if they wanted it different to run their own damn study and publish it in their own damn book.

[–] HubertManne@piefed.social 1 points 1 day ago

we are a den of scum and villany. You know. Places where like han solo hangs out.

[–] Kolanaki@pawb.social 16 points 3 days ago (1 children)

It's pretty toxic toward right-wing pieces of shit that espouse hate toward minorities, women and queer people. As it should be.

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[–] Auster@thebrainbin.org 111 points 4 days ago (2 children)

Skimmed through the article and something picked my attention, the numbers given in the "325000 posts analyzed". The way its given, it makes seem like big numbers, but if you calculate what is the percentage of the numbers given, it's less than 1%. Can't check the linked source, but it seems like a classical "lying with statistics".

And besides, text seems written in a way to give the impression site moderation for smaller sites is too stupid to block bad actors, and that only the paternalism of bigger sites can solve this implied issue.

[–] styanax@lemmy.world 67 points 4 days ago (9 children)

The entire tone of the article feels... condescending? (not sure the exact feeling). It feels off in the way information is presented, like subtle disdain in the writing voice.

[–] supersquirrel@sopuli.xyz 50 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago) (1 children)

1.) This is part of the background narratives being pushed by the rich and powerful that we need AI and big tech to moderate us when the opposite is true, we need more humans involved in moderation who have a stake in their community.

2.) The prevailing winds in the tech journalism sphere have always been strangely blowing against the Fediverse since the beginning. The simplest possible explanation to me is there is a lot of money in writing off the Fediverse as a cool nerdy space that nonetheless is an unrealistic solution for everybody else and pushing the axiom that a Harvard MBA is needed to translate the Fediverse into a product the public can actually use.

You will NOT notice this same prevailing winds against for profit corporate social networks like Bluesky and Threads... and it is a curious thing isn't it...

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[–] glimse@lemmy.world 101 points 4 days ago (1 children)

The crappiness of this section has been noted

[–] moubliezpas@lemmy.world 17 points 3 days ago

Someone put that on in the last 12 hours, and since then, some anonymous person just deleted the entire section lol.

I legit feel really grateful, I'd been going down a bit of a 'either every source of information is corrupt and there's no hope, or I'm losing my mind' rabbit hole. I haven't quite pulled the plug on Reddit yet, which may be contributing to that.

I prefer the whole 'major additions and changes should be introduced in the talk section of a page so it can be discussed by the committee of reasonable good faith adults with lots of spare time and patience' approach to Wikipedia editing, but in retrospect that may be a wee bit idealistic in current times. So the 'one person complains and documents, another person flags, and another just deletes the entire thing' is a process that may be a good compromise between The Way Things Should Be and how to edit Wikipedia with consensus and without being harassed by neo Nazis.

[–] hector@lemmy.today 5 points 2 days ago

Financial interests pay people to edit.

Mysteriously my ip is banned from editing when I tried to view talk on a suspect edit, even though I have never once edited a page or even accessed that part by this ip. None on former ip's either.

Ip is on some shady brazillian blacklist so maybe that is it idk, everyone just trusting shady internet players.

[–] IndustryStandard@lemmy.world 17 points 3 days ago

Today you learned any idiot can edit Wikipedia and it is mostly done by pro government entities.

[–] Aatube@kbin.melroy.org 39 points 4 days ago (2 children)

it looks like somebody who just saw this post edited wikipedia for the first time to remove that. this is why wikipedia's wonderful: it's that easy. i have this quirk where i wanna debate anyone who distrusts wikipedia or claim its rigidity

[–] moubliezpas@lemmy.world 14 points 3 days ago

They did! The change log shows the main section of 'I found a single paper criticising the fediverse so here's 600 words on how terrible the concept is', and also reassured me that I wasn't just being lazy in not wanting to trawl through the text to edit it to be less awful.

I'm bizarrely excited about it too. You can't thank anonymous Wikipedia editors, so I'll throw a vague 'thank you!' out into the world and try to pay it forward.

My next battle: figuring out why I can't edit this post, lol (maybe a mobile problem) and long term, why I didn't think of 'just edit it anonymously'.

[–] technocrit@lemmy.dbzer0.com 5 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) (2 children)

lmao wait until it's reverted, argued over, then the editor gets banned.

[–] hector@lemmy.today 2 points 2 days ago

My ip got banned despite never editing wikipedia, never even reading the talk.

[–] Aatube@kbin.melroy.org 6 points 3 days ago

go on, show me

[–] atrielienz@lemmy.world 3 points 2 days ago (1 children)

It's pretty cool being a member of a den of iniquity.

[–] solrize@lemmy.world 3 points 2 days ago (1 children)

Meh. I'm holding out for wretched hive of scum and villainy.

[–] moubliezpas@lemmy.world 1 points 1 day ago

I can bring villainy and snacks, maybe some sandwiches or something?

[–] Aatube@kbin.melroy.org 58 points 4 days ago (3 children)

That section is out of line with Wikipedia policies because it only relies upon scholarship that isn't meta-analysis, which Wikipedia considers primary sourcing (an idiosyncratic borrowing that ought to be called firsthand sourcing instead: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Reliable_sources#Scholarship), making it undue weight.

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[–] Flax_vert@feddit.uk 13 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago)

I have seen worse stuff on Instagram and Reddit than I have seen on the fediverse... and I use the fediverse far more.

it is impossible for an instance to be "removed" from the Fediverse

That's just how the internet works.

As with Wikipedia, I saw the same stuff with articles regarding religious topics that were just heavily guarded by a neckbeard atheist who had unreasonable expectations.

[–] FartsWithAnAccent@fedia.io 30 points 4 days ago (1 children)

I haven't seen any of that shit on the fediverse except maybe conspiracy theories (which are way more prevalent on other websites), wtf are they talking about?

[–] ripcord@lemmy.world 9 points 4 days ago

Dunno, someone finally got around to fixing the article, though.

[–] Blue_Morpho@lemmy.world 23 points 4 days ago (2 children)

There was a few months where I had to ban server after server every day because someone was really into semi-lolli anime. They were posting it in every anime forum. I asked them why they were non stop posting upskirt or provocative drawings of very young girls and they got angry that I dared ask.

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[–] mlg@lemmy.world 17 points 4 days ago (2 children)

Lol wait till you see any of the Pakistan or India related articles. Its like the Ganges river in text form.

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[–] ozoned@piefed.social 17 points 4 days ago (1 children)

YUP! Can confirm, den of iniquity over here! Just like the fact I've been running Linux for 18 years now, so I'm obviously a hacker and a subversive. We enjoy things here like CHOICE and FREEDOM. You're all fucking DEVIANTS! And so am I! DEVIANTS OF THE WORLD UNITE!

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[–] Skavau@piefed.social 20 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

"Legal reform has also been proposed, most notably around Section 230 of the Communications Decency Act, as well as proposed legal requirements for instance operators to engage in good-faith moderation of instance connections."

The source for this is a a paper written in January 2024 by someone called Nikhil Mahadeva.

Lets be clear, any Section 230 discussion will never mention the Fediverse. That implies anyone who wants to erode even knows what the Fediverse is.

[–] OpenStars@piefed.social 11 points 4 days ago (12 children)

Beware of unearned knowledge.

You "lose" 100% of the battles that you choose not to fight.

Besides, people here are reporting that the content is already gone. Even if it comes back, it likely will bounce around back and forth but not return to this same state, so this was transient.

Even so, it seems not wrong? "toxic or abusive content being common in the Fediverse", regardless of how precisely that is measured, seems entirely accurate to me. YOU (and I) may choose to block such content, in part by being on an instance that enacts this choice for us, but that does not mean that such does not exist. Head on over to Chapotraphouse@hexbear.net to get a taste of what the Fediverse offers. It does exist, and while Lemmy.World defederated from it, so many other instances including Lemm.ee did not. Or Lemmygrad.ml.

It is so easy to forget about what was shoved under the rug, but the Fediverse is more like 4chan than most of us care to admit. Just because there are no Nazis currently standing in your little corner of a Nazi bar does not mean that you can invite your Jewish friends over to walk (safely) through the front door.

The Fediverse can be quite toxic. So much so that I've entirely stopped recommending it to people irl. We need to be more acceptable to people if we want to change our image, not just pretend that we are fine.

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[–] 30p87@feddit.org 13 points 4 days ago

That section is just pure Ragebait lol

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