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this post was submitted on 19 Aug 2024
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To preface, I am not defending the police or the piece of shit abuser. This was handled extraordinarily horrendously. Police even knew about the guy's crimes and let him off without a slap on the wrist.
The basis of my thoughts comes from this paragraph in the article:
I don't know any info beyond what the article gives, but it sounds like at that point she wasn't being held captive and murdered to get away from her abuser. She actively plotted and had the freedom to travel and kill him. Unless there's something I'm missing, I don't think I could consider this as actively being self defense.
No but it was deserved justice for a crime that was going unpunished
Do we really want vigilantism though? Because that's where this leads.
Maybe the police should do their job for a change.
Not defending the cops here but the guy was arrested. The justice system set him free again.
Fair enough, the courts didn't do thier job. The courts and the police work for us. If they fail us, we have to take over. That should be the defense.
You literally just described vigilante justice.
Just a thought: what happens when that "we" is people who - say - think the courts and the police are not doing their job in sending home all "these illegal immigrants" or something like that?
This is not even a slope, it is the application of the same principle applied by people who have different views and morality.
Edit: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Categorical_imperative
That is supposed to be the motivation for the system to do it's job... preventing groups with minority opinions from taking matters into thier own hands. But that doesn't seem to be enough anymore. I don't suggest this path because it is a good choice. It's a horrible choice. Innocent people will be hurt or killed for sure. But that is already happening in larger and larger numbers from the systems inaction. And the cost of inaction is past the tipping point with the cost of action. And I see no other choice. But I am open to suggestions.
Then we have a nice little civil war again, kill a few million of them, and this time when they surrender for the second time, we do a hard reset of their entire culture - no monuments, no statues, no memorials, no representation or voting for any of them or any who aided or abetted them, or their children, or their children's children.
Right, violence works usually works to eradicate ideas and standardize morality!
Which is true, and also doesn't address the point. (Also, obligatory ACAB.)
The problem with vigilantism is that the vigilante both decides whether an offense has been committed, and what the punishment should be for that offense. If I've been hit repeatedly by people speeding in my neighborhood, and cops aren't giving the speeders tickets, no one in their right mind is going to say that I should start shooting at people driving in my neighborhood. (Or, I would hope no one in their right mind would say that.)
She knew whether an offense had been committed.
That doesn't prove it to anyone else, of course, but it doesn't seem like anyone is (now?) contesting the the offense in question was committed. Just that he got off free and she had no recourse. This is not a one time event, either, it's a pattern where the law fails to protect people in this situation and then throws the book at them if they take matters into their own hands. If she had not, do you think this dude would still be free? Or would the law have eventually caught up to him, after who knows how many more victims?
You don't get a license to kill just because the justice system failed you. I'm loving how everyone is screaming about how bad the justice system is with this case yet they think a bunch of pissed off ppl thirsty for revenge is a somehow the more measured and practical solution.
What if after she set the house on fire it burned down the whole block? What if the guy had a victim in the house with him when it happened? Another person pointed out she could've destroyed evidence from other victims. Two wrongs don't make a right
I'm not saying it's more measured or practical, I'm saying it's inevitable when the system doesn't serve the people. I'm saying chaos is preferable to tyranny.
Even if she didn't harm any other people - the criminal justice system in the US doesn't allow for the death penalty for cases of rape. (And in point of fact, part of the reason that we don't do that any more is because it tended to be disproportionately applied against black men accused of assaulting white women.)
There's still answers out there that are "more right" than others.
Jill, what do you think the price of this bag of rice is? $8.50? Unfortunately, not correct at all. Bob? The 1950s Hall of Rock and Roll on VHS? That's a thoroughly nonsensical answer that barely even respects the question! The answer was $11.
Sentencing judge, what do you think this man's punishment for rape should be? Nothing? Oh, wow, that's a very obviously wrong answer! Vigilante, your go. Well, we were looking for "A life sentence with chance of parole after 30 years", but I will say, "Shoot him in the head" is closer to correct.
I feel like some people there's a "magic light" applied to courtrooms with judges, that makes their judgments more fair by implication. But it's absolutely possible for three people in lawnchairs discussing matters over beer to make a more fair judgment than some judges.
When the official justice system fails people, some of them will take matters into their own hands. Frankly it's surprising there isn't more political violence targeting police and corrupt judges.
And remember, jury nullification exists.
ahem Yes, surprising. And, yes it does.
In this case? Absolutely yes.
Are you willing to universalize that though? Are you willing to allow all people that believe that they have been treated unjustly to take justice into their own hands?
That's not how it works.
That's essentially what happened here. She wasn't at risk any longer and the murder was premeditated. The prosecutor did their job here as they are supposed to, and it was sentenced as it should have been according to the law.
That being said, this is really why we have pardons, and I hope one is granted in this case.
Do we know she wasn’t at risk any longer? I don’t see that in the article. Or what about this guys other victims. Are they also no longer at risk? Again, don’t see mention of that in this article
If it was a movie she would be the protagonist at least
There's a whole season of Dexter with basically this premise
Trauma is a hell of a thing to deal with. Feeling unsafe as long as a person's abuser walks freely, even if they are far away, is VERY common. I'd imagine if it was someone who was repeatedly abused that'd magnify the trauma response.
Not saying she didn't murder that guy, but knowledge about the psychological effects of sexual abuse does give context to her actions. If she was feeling tortured by this unsafe feeling, like he could come back at anytime to hurt her again, and almost obesessing over it(trauma can do this to anyone) I can see why she did what she did.
It's not like mental health care and support is widely available to people here in the US. Shit is expensive, and that's if your insurance covers it...if you even have insurance. Add in trying to find someone who specializes in trauma care and it can get really overwhelming and discouraging. People give up on seeking help and spiral.
A lot of things could've prevented this. Things like easy access to mental health support, or I dunno...actually putting rapists in jail where they can't hurt more people.