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submitted 1 month ago by ironsoap@lemmy.one to c/ukraine@sopuli.xyz

Joe Biden has called off a four-day trip to Germany this week that had been intended to culminate in a summit to discuss Volodymyr Zelenskyy’s “victory plan” for Ukraine.

The White House said on Tuesday evening that the president would stay at home “to oversee preparations for and the response” to Hurricane Milton, which is expected to make landfall in Florida on Wednesday.

It was not clear how Biden’s absence would affect the planned summit, the first time world leaders were due to gather at the Ramstein US airbase, normally the location of a regular meeting of defence ministers to discuss military aid for Kyiv.

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[-] benignintervention@lemmy.world 42 points 1 month ago

Right? It's like not showing up to the Monday morning meeting because your basement flooded. Give the man credit where it's due

[-] Lost_My_Mind@lemmy.world 25 points 1 month ago

They never do. Biden was a good president. And yet, everybody hates him. The right hate him, because they hate everybody on the left. The left hate him for reasons I don't understand. He's the modern day Jimmy Carter. Great president that for some reason has his merrits diminished for reasons I may never understand.

The left hate him for reasons I don’t understand.

Most don't, actually. But of the (probably small) subset who do:

Basically feel he's too rightward. He had to shift right in order to win over some split ticket never trumper votes, which likely tipped him over the edge into winning the presidency. Then had to stay rightward in order to make sure he (or Harris now) wins re-election. Harris too is now coming off as more centralist and less progressive than she was in, for example, 2019.

Some lefties are also worried because they feel scandalized by what happened with Hunter Biden. This doesn't really reflect on Joe imho but a few on the left disagree.

[-] BlemboTheThird@lemmy.ca 3 points 1 month ago* (last edited 1 month ago)

I seriously doubt going to the center wins any votes in the general. The type of people who think conservative policy is good for society are gonna vote Republican no matter how stupid and fascist it is. "Shifting right wins over never Trumpers" is a line that works on people during the primary when everyone is on the left anyway, but in the end it's an excuse to more deeply entrench the oligarchy and it turns off people who need something to be excited about in order to bother coming out for the general. Like, I can't imagine young voters were happy to hear Harris at the debate talking about how she's going to expand oil drilling.

Biden won because leftists were energized about getting Trump out of office, not because centrism won over conservatives. In fact, I think the centrism is why he was projected to lose this year! His presidency went fine considering the senate, but fact is he didn't do a whole lot to get people interested. Gaffes and age notwithstanding, even a perfect public speaker wouldn't have had much to work with. That's why the switch to Harris got the poll numbers moving: it was a big move that got people engaged. But I firmly believe every move she makes to the center is doing more to turn off leftist voters than it is wresting people from the right.

I seriously doubt going to the center wins any votes in the general.

I think this is the only point where we have a real disagreement. There were indeed folks who split their ticket in 2020 - voting for Biden-Harris but otherwise voting for all GOP, see https://www.texastribune.org/2020/11/16/split-ticket-voting-texas-republicans/

See also this chart, showing that such a split ticket is about 4% out of everyone who voted: https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/wp-content/uploads/
sites/4/2020/10/PP_2020.10.21_split-icket-voting_0-01.png

Now, it just says that 4% of voters split R/D. But I can't imagine anything more than a negligible amount were from Dems who voted for you-know-who as President. Therefore, that 4% can be attributed to Republicans who voted for Biden.

Maybe this would have happened anyways, but I suspect that going rightward made this kind of split easier for those folks to swallow.

Finally, look at the small margins that Biden won on the swing states according to https://www.npr.org/2020/12/02/940689086/narrow-wins-in-these-key-states-powered-biden-to-the-presidency. So what this could mean, assuming that the 4% holds generally, is that the 4% difference cause by split voting is greater than the margin that Biden won in those swing states. If Biden was too leftie, he might have lost those votes - and those states - and the Electoral College.

in the end it’s an excuse to more deeply entrench the oligarchy and it turns off people who need something to be excited about in order to bother coming out for the general.

I feel like Harris is coming up with new strategies on this point to compenstate, like getting on "Call Me Daddy" and Howard Stern, along with powerful endorsements such as Taylor Swift's.

I can’t imagine young voters were happy to hear Harris at the debate talking about how she’s going to expand oil drilling.

Yeah, it shows what a struggle it is to go with the centralism strategy - staying too far left may cost the votes needed to win the EC but going too far right may cause faithful voters to sit the election out, which may cost the popular vote - and thus the EC if it's bad enough.

Biden won because leftists were energized about getting Trump out of office,

Agreed, this was definitely a reason

not because centrism won over conservatives.

I think both might have been contributing actually.

And there are probably many others. Here's one third factor - 2020's election happened just mere months after the pandemic. The president at the time was in denial and a lot of people died due to the mismanaged response - and that may have been reflected in the votes.

I think the centrism is why he was projected to lose this year! Gaffes and age notwithstanding, even a perfect public speaker wouldn’t have had much to work with.

My impression was that Dem party leadership and donors took action after seeing the debate - and that was primarily because of age and gaffes. Of course, upper management and the wealthy tend to skew someone conservative anyways so perhaps not the best sample.

But I firmly believe every move she makes to the center is doing more to turn off leftist voters than it is wresting people from the right.

I really hope this is not true. I kinda feel she really needs both sets of votes right now to win. It didn't seem to be true in 2020 - but of course 2024 is a different year, and more importantly Harris is a very different candidate from Biden.

[-] HubertManne@moist.catsweat.com 5 points 1 month ago

I was thinking how biden seems like carter. honestly though I think biden accomplished more with less.

[-] fuckingkangaroos@lemm.ee 4 points 1 month ago

Some on the left "hate" him because of Kremlin propaganda on social media.

this post was submitted on 08 Oct 2024
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