UK Politics
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!ukpolitics@lemm.ee appears to have vanished! We can still see cached content from this link, but goodbye I guess! :'(
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No. I don't think it was a pointless waste of time, money and effort. I am aware this goes against the majority in here but I hope we can talk about it in good faith and not fall back into entrenched views as has often happened in the past.
First let me start by saying... If a relationship isn't working you DON'T have to stay. It doesn't matter what pressure you're put under or if they try to shame you or turn everyone against you. If it isn't working, you leave.
I voted for Brexit because I was shocked at how corrupt, wasteful and unaccountable the EU had become. Instead of becoming the sum of the best qualities each member brought to the table, it appeared to be a shocking mess of all our worst features. I wanted them to realise that a member state could leave and I hoped that in doing so they would look at themselves and improve things. Also, I was fully aware that the UK was far from some kind of utopia and I did wonder if having to go it alone for a while might not also make us look at our issues as well.
So for me, it has been a useful process. Brexit has prompted the EU to reflect on its operations in many ways, leading to many reforms and adaptations. The EU has taken steps towards greater financial coordination, joint initiatives, and strengthened environmental policies.
I will say that the absence of the UK's influence has also led to concerns about increased bureaucracy and regulatory complexity but overall, Brexit has prompted the EU to adapt, evolve and become more efficient. Now, so long as there's a mutually respectful way to do it, I'm all for getting cosy with the EU again so long as we don't go back to the old ways.
(Edit: Right-o this has been fun. I'm actually pleasantly surprised that not all of you resorted to all the usual nasty behaviours that keep so many of us Brexiteers quiet in places like this. Regardless, I feel like I've answered the central question of this thread "Do you agree that Brexit has been a pointless waste of time, money and effort?" so won't be expanding any further. Here's to a better future with a wiser EU and a more sensible UK. Toodlepip!)
I wish you'd fucked off somewhere else instead of voting for Brexit
In this thread
Also in this thread
😢
just because someone advocates harmful policies in a polite way, doesn't mean they aren't an advocate for harm.
That's the point of civil debates. To discuss and challenge the ideas in order to reach a better understanding. If you're simply going to tell people to "fuck right off" without addressing their concerns it shows a deep lack of understanding of their concerns and only helps to push them further away from your own position.
What advantage do you get from insulting someone? Whilst I don't agree with the original post, I don't want to excuse this behaviour of the reply.
no it doesn't, people can have "concerns" that are fundamentally incorrect or in bad faith
I'm not saying that people don't have incorrect concerns. I'm saying how does saying "fuck off" as a first response help? You're advocating division with that attitude. I'm saying help those people rather than othering them.
I'm saying its perfectly reasonable for some to meet one insult with another, just because you don't see the first insult doesn't mean its not there or that its anyone else's obligation to spell things out for you. also, sorry, but "pushing people away from a position" is preposterous. this "look how you made me vote!" stuff is so childish.
Where was the insult in OP's post?
I only saw OP putting their points across quite peacefully and then out of nowhere