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What are your opinions on anti-natalism? (lemmy.ml)

submitted 1 day ago by nutbutter@discuss.tchncs.de to c/asklemmy@lemmy.ml

118 comments fedilink hide all child comments

Anti-natalism is the philosophical value judgment that procreation is unethical or unjustifiable. Antinatalists thus argue that humans should abstain from making children. Some antinatalists consider coming into existence to always be a serious harm. Their views are not necessarily limited only to humans but may encompass all sentient creatures, arguing that coming into existence is a serious harm for sentient beings in general. There are various reasons why antinatalists believe human reproduction is problematic. The most common arguments for antinatalism include that life entails inevitable suffering, death is inevitable, and humans are born without their consent. Additionally, although some people may turn out to be happy, this is not guaranteed, so to procreate is to gamble with another person's suffering. WIKIPEDIA

If you think, maybe for a few years, like 10-20 years, no one should make babies, and when things get better, we can continue, then you are not an anti-natalist. Anti-natalists believe that suffering will always be there and no one should be born EVER.

This photo was clicked by a friend, at Linnahall.

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[–] theacharnian@lemmy.ca 4 points 5 hours ago* (last edited 5 hours ago)

You're contradicting your own argument:

It was never meant to remedy shitty living conditions.

Ask anyone with disabilities, abusive families, trauma, financial hardship, and generally going though too much shit in life and you'll find that it was never about a lack of imagination.

This is a contradiction. You are literally picking the antinatalist option because of shitty living conditions.

And of course, the lack of imagination is not whether you can imagine things being better but whether you can imagine things becoming better starting from where we are here and now.

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We suffer because we are able to imagine how things could have been so much better. It is because we can imagine ourselves in a better place

If you can imagine such a place, steelman your argument then, try making it without a premise of shitty living conditions. Pick a convivial world, and make an antinatalist argument from that world. Does it still stand?

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Finally, the argument that says nonexistence might be better is literally vacuous: False implies True. Nonexistence therefore is trivially whatever you want it to be, but not In any meaningful sense.