453
quick reminder
(lemmy.world)
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
this post was submitted on 22 Jul 2023
453 points (77.5% liked)
Memes
45581 readers
1217 users here now
Rules:
- Be civil and nice.
- Try not to excessively repost, as a rule of thumb, wait at least 2 months to do it if you have to.
founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
In the entirety of human history communism has never worked. Not once has any society been able to work on the ideals of it.
It's impossible to uncouple society from capitalism. It's not a possibility, but it definitely could work. Maybe capitalism just needs longer than communism to fail?
The wealthiest country in the world has unaffordable healthcare and homelessness, how is that capitalism working?
Yeah, because the US bombs them or funds terror cells or blockades their economy.
Cold War. Communism was hunted and destroyed whereever it arose.
If communism was so strong it wouldn't have to worry about capitalist intervention. You just proved my point of communism / socialism being weak if the apparent enemy is easily able to wreck you economy and implode your country it is not a strong system.
Might makes right, then?
In terms of global politics, yes. Every country has fallen back into capitalism in some form, the closest I can think of being truly, actually communist were the Spanish Anarchists based out of Barcelona during the Spanish Civil War. If you would like to read about them I recommend George Orwell's "Homage to Catalonia." Everyone made the same amount, they called each other comrade regardless of rank, etc. They did not last long though, taken out by their own democratic allies during the Civil War.
I disagree. Countries controlled by communist parties today have retreated from socialism by enacting market reforms, but they haven't fallen. A fallen revolution wouldn't bother to call itself communist anymore.
China, in particular, seems to be on a good trajectory and has made a lot of progress towards socialism. There's a reason they tried harder than pretty much every other country on Earth to save their people during the pandemic, despite how much that might have hurt their economy.
China isn't communist, but it's progressive and they're getting there. The revolution just isn't over yet 😘
China is in no way shape or form socialist lmao. They're just another flavor of authoritarian capitalist. If you really think the PRC will every make any meaningful attempts to improve or become more progressive then you are very delusional. The PRC is probably the farthest from progressive you can get. It's a brutal and unforgiving regime.
Zero COVID proves China is literally different than every other capitalist nation on Earth. Even if you don't believe the official data, the excess death rate (i.e. something they can't hide) shows they beat pretty much everyone other than extreme outliers like New Zealand.
I just googled China COVID Death rate and every story is about China underreporting at every step of the process. The fact you believe anything coming from that government is sad and stupid. China trying to pass off zero COVID deaths is just another indicator at a failing state under an oppressive and deadly regime.
The excess death rate, again something that can't be faked, proves China outperformed everyone else.
They can lie an say a death from COVID was actually a heart attack or a stroke or the flu, but they can't just disappear bodies and pretend they're still alive.
https://www.nytimes.com/2023/07/19/world/asia/china-covid-data-toll.html
https://time.com/6247534/china-covid-death-toll-underreporting/
https://www.irishtimes.com/world/asia-pacific/2023/07/18/china-deletes-data-on-covid-19-deaths/
Here's three articles on the messing with COVID numbers and hiding true death counts. It's incredibly easy to hide true death tolls in such a large country that's effectively cut off from the rest of the world's news. If you control the data being pushed out and there's a severe lack of checking if they're true or not, it's incredibly easy to hide deaths, either misreporting them like you mentioned or just not reporting them at all. Current US death rates from COVID are 1 million, while investigations form the NYT reports at least triple that in China, if not more. Again, failed state under an oppressive and deadly regime.
Manipulating COVID death counts isn't disappearing the actual deaths themselves. We know deaths still happened, like the Time article said "China’s True COVID Death Toll Estimated To Be in Hundreds of Thousands" - so let us assume that's completely true!
1.4 billion people live in China. The fact that only a few hundred thousand died is a miracle that almost no other country can match when you actually start comparing numbers directly. China outperformed everyone else when you measure how many people died against how many people didn't die. If China just let er rip like America did, over 6 million would have died. Think about that.
You misread the article, that hundreds of thousands statistic is only for the most recent batch of COVID. Also, if China and the US are comparable, it would be about 4 million. If China was comparable to another country, like say Ireland, it would be around 2.5 million. My figure of about 3 million seems accurate enough for this argument. Your devotion to this regime is unfortunate, you should consider reevaluating your decisions and take a fresh look at the awfulness that happens to the people of China everyday.
I can't read the NYT article because it's behind a paywall lol
Gotta love western "freedom of press"