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this post was submitted on 06 Aug 2023
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he says that now… when the time comes, however, exactly what will his “compliance” look like?
sure, I believe he’d show up, but I also believe he’ll give mostly equivocations, pleas to the 5th, non-remembrances, and non-answer answers that mostly cover his own ass and deflect blame from the GOP than testimony that would give any real insight into or damning evidence against Trump or his co-conspirators.
If Pence had any desire to serve justice, he would have done so long, long ago.
What could he have done?
He seems like a straight guy in every sense of the word. I vehemently disagree with his politics but I am sure that he will testify truthfully.
That's a tough one. The guy is such a scumbag, but repeatedly telling trump no and refusing to be above the law was a huge thing. I actually respect him for doing that.
Is he 100% off the trump train? Is it enough so he won't hold back? Hopefully his sense of honor for the country he seems to have will be strong enough to not hand waive things away.
refusing to break the law wasn’t a pious act— he just didn’t want to face the consequences. I think he might have if he thought he could get away with it. I just don’t think he’s as stupid or delusional as Trump, et al.
Nobody is saying that his act is pious. But saying that he will act as the other crazies is inaccurate.
And I don't even like the guy!
oh, no, I think you’re misunderstanding me— or maybe I should explain better. Pence certainly wound’t do any of this to help them but to help himself. I don’t think we can ever entirely know his motivations but can only approximate or triangulate them based on his past/current behaviors. Pence is a tremendously selfish and self-motivated person driven almost entirely by his own self-interest. He only seems to do anything at all if he thinks he can personally benefit— and, likewise, would not do something if it would be to his detriment.
So, if he does something like the other nutbags, their motivations wouldn’t be the same, just that he thought he could get something out of it. Likewise, he didn’t participate in the vote delegate bullshit Trump asked him to, not because he “believes in democracy” or the constitutional rule of law/transfer of power— it’s because he knew it was a harebrained scheme that would never work, and they’d all end up in jail or worse.
turns out it was the right decision.
He ain't no angel, like I said the guy is a scumbag. But he could have easily gone along with trump at any time, he chose not to. That seems to be extremely rare for people around trump to do.
I think you might be right in your last sentence. That's probably the defining attribute in play.
as I’ve said elsewhere, Pence didn’t go along with Trump because he’s not insane or an idiot. He knew better and is (and always has been) only in it of himself. It didn’t serve his interests and he has no real interest in helping Trump, and he knew it wouldn’t work and would land him in forever prison. It had nothing to do with doing the right thing.
Oh I agree with you on that.
It's going to be either really interesting if/when he takes the stand, or a complete waste of time.
I never said that I expect he’d commit perjury
You didn't, but you put him in the same lump as Gaetz, McConnell or that woman who I refuse to name.
oh, I’d expect Gaetz to outright lie on the stand, and wouldn’t be surprised if he’s done it many times already. McConnell and She-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named? Well, he’s smarter than that, and she definitely isn’t. She’d blurt out the truth and get nailed for it!
That's certainly what he's done in the media, but I'm not so sure that's how he'll respond when 1) he's answering narrow questions crafted by an experienced attorney and 2) he's answering questions after having sworn to God that he would tell the truth
the traitor also swore on the bible hed uphold the constitution from all enemies foreign AND DOMESTIC
his displayed pattern of behavior for the past several decades has been a hateful, self-serving scumbag. why would that suddenly change now?
The question is, is that hate and self serving aimed at trump now?
this is my take on what’s happening with him now: it’s political posturing. he knows he’s likely to be called at least for a deposition, and he’s getting in front of the media coverage by offering, or, at least, by saying he’d be cooperative. now, to a public audience, that can mean whatever we want it to mean, and to his base, that means he’s an angel who did nothing wrong, a patriot deserving of their vote. because he’s a law-abiding victim!
to the discerning listener, it’s a cover-his-ass declaration meaning nothing much now and whatever he wants it to mean later, especially if he changes his mind, as the legal and media landscape remains fluid between now and then. what will actually transpire? we’ll have to wait and see.
Agreed
Pence? I don't like the guy for his religious ideologies, but that man is furious at what Trump did to him on Jan 6.
I don't think he'll go above and beyond to bury Trump, but he won't be putting impediments to the prosecution at all.
yeah, he hates trump, but he loves the GOP, and hurting Trump hurts the GOP.
and while I don’t think he’d hurt the prosecution, I have serious doubts as to how much he’d actually help them.