381
ZRAM is insane (www.kernel.org)
submitted 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) by wolf@lemmy.zip to c/linux@lemmy.ml

I got a cheap netbook style laptop for traveling some weeks ago (HP Stream 11" with 4 GB of RAM and a N4120). Didn't expect much more from this hardware than opening a few browser tabs and doing some retro gaming via Steam.

Shared RAM with graphics card means that 3.64 GB of RAM are effectively usable for the OS. This was even too little RAM to open a handful of tabs w/o having tabs being unresponsive for seconds sometimes in a very annoying way. Another thing which made trouble was the Wifi - I guess it went into power saving, was swapped and didn't load fast enough to provide a good experience. (Of course I wasted an hour checking for Wifi drivers/support.)

In short: Even for my low expectations for this laptop it was an underwhelming experience.

First step was to look at my vm.swappiness and set it to 10, which already helped, but still the machine had hiccups and annoying timeouts.

In a last, desperate effort I enabled ZRAM on the laptop... and literally WTF: Saying it is a night and day difference doesn't do the experience justice. Typing this words now on the Stream, which I use exactly the same way as my much more beefy other machines (my next worst computer has 8G of RAM and an Intel Core i3), browsing with 10 open tabs, e-mail client open on another virtual desktop... it is crazy, it makes the Stream fun to use and I use it at home for everything which isn't heavily CPU/IO bound.

What surprised me the most: No hiccups, no timeouts and it even fixed the Wifi issues on this little machine. Didn't expect this would be possible, especially with a N4120 and 3.64 GB of RAM.

In short, my laptop changed from not even reaching my low/realistic expectations to being my favorite technical purchase of the last years, thanks to ZRAM.

Besides making this a ZRAM appreciation post, I really want to spread the word about it. Especially for old hardware and limited RAM situations, IMHO it should be the first thing which comes to mind/is recommended.

Fedora and PopOS use it by default, so it is well tested and should IMHO again, be a default at least for desktop setups.

Give it a try - supposedly it even improved the experience on much more beefy computers for gaming etc.

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[-] Animortis@kbin.social 44 points 1 year ago

Anyone know of an eli5 on zram? I don't see why just compressing your RAM would make it run better.

[-] Still@programming.dev 36 points 1 year ago

stops having to swap pages to disk, slightly more overhead on the CPU side but for most systems that will be an order of magnitude faster that swapping to disk

[-] wolf@lemmy.zip 29 points 1 year ago

Let me give it a try:

Imagine you are having breakfast and sitting on your breakfast table. Everything on your table and reachable w/o getting up is what your CPU holds in its register. When you need something from the fridge in your home, this is your RAM. If you need something that is not in your fridge, you have to get dressed, get out of our home, walk to the groceries store which is half an hour away, find what you are looking for, pay for it, walk home for around half an our, switch back to your relaxed clothing and finally you can continue your breakfast. The groceries store is your hard disk/ssd whatever. With compression, imagine you have a big second fridge in the basement (or the house next to yours, you get the idea). Not as good as having stuff on your table or in your fridge, but usually at least an order of magnitude better than having to visit the groceries store.

[-] ReversalHatchery@beehaw.org 27 points 1 year ago

Turns out usually a significant amount of RAM is compressible. I was surprised at it too, and actually still am. But of course it also depends on how you use your system. If you run a media player that caches a lot to RAM, its cache wont be compressible, but they say its efficient for example for memory of web browsers.

[-] chellomere@lemmy.world 37 points 1 year ago

I'm running ZRAM on my old Netgear ReadyNAS's, which has 512MB or 256MB RAM. It enables them to do a lot more than they otherwise would be able to, running a modern linux distribution.

I've been so satisfied with it that I even started running it on my modern desktop with 32GB RAM, it helps with my tab addiction :)

[-] wolf@lemmy.zip 20 points 1 year ago

Rolling out ZRAM to all my boxes right now! 🙃

Do you also tweak other settings for ZRAM? According to ArchWiki PopOS settled for the following settings:

vm.swappiness = 180
vm.watermark_boost_factor = 0
vm.watermark_scale_factor = 125
vm.page-cluster = 0

I am testing this settings right now and cannot say I experience a difference compared to the defaults.

[-] Zucca@sopuli.xyz 4 points 1 year ago

vm.swappiness value should be between 0 and 100 IIRC.

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[-] chellomere@lemmy.world 3 points 1 year ago

I don't really tweak much. I use the Debian default of 50 percent RAM used. For the NAS's I tell it to use lz4 as they're pretty weak cpu-wise.

[-] Thief@lemmy.myserv.one 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Has anyone ever actually benchmarked vm.page-cluster = 0? Makes no sense to me to suggest a cpu is so bottlenecked that disabling read-ahead would actually help. If anything it would mitigate the decompression time if it guessed correctly as the work would already be done if left at the default of 3. Normally cpu is not bound when using zram because its quite low cpu anyway.

[-] wolf@lemmy.zip 2 points 1 year ago

For my own usage, I just enabled ZRAM, 50% with zstd and left all other options unchanged, which seems to be the conservative approach and more important: It works on my machines(TM).

I would love to see some benchmarks or even a structured run down about the available options and configurations.

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[-] henfredemars@infosec.pub 28 points 1 year ago

If you like ZRAM, make sure you also enable MG-LRU and consider using ZSWAP with z3fold allocator instead because it's capable of dumping older compressed pages to swap file whereas ZRAM, once full, is simply bypassed until pages in the store are freed.

I do number crunching on memory constrained systems. MG-LRU improves the efficiency of page reclaim, and ZSWAP interacts much more nicely if you have a swap file also.

[-] wolf@lemmy.zip 11 points 1 year ago

Thank you for your advice. Right now my setup works so I'll try to not waste my entire weekend playing with technology, but if I need further tweaks in the future I'll look into ZSWAP.

One question: Do you know why Fedora and PopOS decided for ZRAM and against ZSWAP? As I wrote already somewhere else: I did choose ZRAM for it being default in Fedora, which gave me some trust that people better informed/experienced choose ZRAM over ZSWAP.

[-] henfredemars@infosec.pub 7 points 1 year ago

Totally understandable. I have done the wasting of weekends just to go back to where I started.

I think that ZRAM has a simpler implementation and has a history of being more widely used whereas ZSWAP is only recently seeing more usage as a default. I suspect it's in the interest of stability and because the implementation is better characterized.

With that said, MG-LRU is not enabled by default for the same reason, but it has a big impact such that it's the default on newer Android devices. Stability is a relative term.

[-] wolf@lemmy.zip 4 points 1 year ago

Thank you very much for the write up! I'll have to investigate more about ZSWAP. Have a nice weekend!

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[-] slampisko@czech-lemmy.eu 23 points 1 year ago

So ZRAM is RAM, but compressed? I didn't know about it, thanks for sharing!

[-] wolf@lemmy.zip 16 points 1 year ago

Technically it is a compressed SWAP disk in RAM, but the compression ratio is impressive and it feels like more RAM for me. My pleasure to share, hope it will help you someday! :-)

[-] TheWoozy@lemmy.dbzer0.com 4 points 1 year ago

It's a compressed ram disk (virtual block device) that is often used for swap.

[-] floppy@rabbitea.rs 12 points 1 year ago

I use this on all my Pis.

[-] selokichtli@lemmy.ml 11 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Some years ago I needed to use more than 100 GB RAM in a 32GB RAM computer, repeatedly. zRAM and swapping in a SSD made the whole thing bearable. In the pandemic, RAM was expensive and I was broke.

[-] sapient_cogbag@infosec.pub 11 points 1 year ago

How does this compare to zswap. For me, if you still want a swap device on a real disk, this might be better? Idk >.<

[-] Atemu@lemmy.ml 21 points 1 year ago

You don't want to combine zram swap and physical swap. When zram swap is full, you'll get LRU inversion because it won't ever evict from zram swap.

Either zram-only or physical+zswap.

So, if you're using a swap partition/file you don't want zRAM, but zSwap is okay. Am I understanding that right?

[-] Atemu@lemmy.ml 3 points 1 year ago
[-] sapient_cogbag@infosec.pub 2 points 1 year ago

Thanks ^.^

I have a very shitty notebook this is likely to be very useful for ;p

[-] wolf@lemmy.zip 3 points 1 year ago

Sorry, just a user myself and because ZRAM is default on Fedora and was easy to setup on Debian, I am just using it.

On the Stream, I have a 4G physical swap partition as a backup, though. AFAIK the physical partition will be utilized by ZRAM when needed. (ZRAM simply has higher priority swap).

[-] psycho_driver@lemmy.world 8 points 1 year ago

A lot of androids are running this now and it seems to work pretty ok.

[-] Rescuer6394@feddit.nl 8 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Isn't zswap enabled by default?

having zram + swap on disk isn't the same as having zswap + swap on disk? the difference should be only that zram show as a swap device while zswap does not.

having only zram, you are still confined by the total ram you have. idk how the average compression ratio is, but you can gain 1.5x ram max. to get more, you need a physical swap device.

is there an advantage of using zram instead of zwap? when you still have a physical swap with lower priority.

bonus question: What if I use all 3 of them? would this just be redundant?

[-] TheWoozy@lemmy.dbzer0.com 8 points 1 year ago

I used zram + swap for years. I dedicated 25% of my memory to zram. The problem is that zram would get filled with infrequently used data, and disk swap would get the frequently used data. Once that happens everything slows down.

Zswap tries to fix that be creating a compressed swap buffer in memory. Older/less used data will get written to disk, but fresh/frequently used data will stay in the compressed ram buffer. That's my understanding, at least. I don't remember how to query Zswap usage stats.

[-] wolf@lemmy.zip 6 points 1 year ago

I am using Debian 12 and I am pretty sure zswap is not enabled by default.

With zstd the compression ratio is better than 3 in all experiments I saw. (Of course you won't get this numbers for random/encrypted data). Right now I have 12MB compressed to 2MB via ZRAM (fresh reboot) which is a factor of 6.

So, taking 3 as factor learned from others and my experience, with 1.8 GB of ZRAM I can store 5.4 GB of memory, adding the 1.8 GB of usual RAM, I end up with 7.2 GB of RAM which is double my 3.6 GB RAM I started with. (All this is backed by 4 GB of physical SWAP.)

Sorry, I cannot really answer your questions concerning zswap vs ZRAM, I just follow the herd and trust that the Fedora people usually have good reasons for their technical choices and are deploying ZRAM by default for several years now.

[-] neo@hexbear.net 2 points 1 year ago

zstd

Just btw, while zstd's compression ratio might be stronger, it will not be as fast as something like lzo-rle. When it comes to RAM you will definitely want to prefer speed unless you have a strict space usage requirement.

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[-] spiffeeroo@programming.dev 4 points 1 year ago

Arch and RHEL enable zswap by default. Regular x86_64 Ubuntu and Debian do not have zswap nor zram enabled by default.

[-] secret301@sh.itjust.works 2 points 1 year ago

For me zram made my system more responsive but the oomd didn't really count it as more ram so sometimes things would get killed earlier than I'd want. ZRAM + regular swap fixed this unless an application was getting really greedy. I kinda wanna try all three now

[-] Rescuer6394@feddit.nl 5 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

check if zswap is already enabled:

zgrep CONFIG_ZSWAP_DEFAULT_ON /proc/config.gz

https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/zswap

[-] eliasp@feddit.de 6 points 1 year ago

zram did wonders back then to the performance/usability of Palm/HP webOS devices, especially the 1st Pre.

[-] optissima@lemmy.world 4 points 1 year ago

I loved my Palm Pre 😔

[-] bigBananas@feddit.nl 3 points 1 year ago

I adored my HP Veer, I bet that if I get a working one in my hands I'll blind-type flawless again in seconds, I was better on that thing than any full size keyboard. Best phone I've ever had because of the keyboard and the ease of customization when you know Javascript. Screen was a bit too small (I consider every modern phone way, way too big) and speed could've been better but wasn't bad.

[-] hjpoijnerflkjn@feddit.de 4 points 1 year ago

Having had massive problems using normal swap in combination with zfs in out of memory situations with high memory pressure I now only - but as default - use zram on bare-metal machines.

[-] ohmesocorny@discuss.online 3 points 1 year ago

Thanks wolf@lemmy.zip !

Thanks to your post and plenty of config tutorials, I've got this set up on my Oracle Free Tier VPS running Ubuntu. It has recently been struggling hard with 1GB ram, requiring reboot. The difference with zram enabled... WOW.

I haven't been able to get zram working on my Ubuntu VPS with another provider though - search results suggest that some providers don't allow swap.

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[-] turdas@suppo.fi 2 points 1 year ago

I have 64 GB of memory in my desktop with 16 GB of zswap. Can't say I've noticed any difference because I haven't actually been in a situation that uses all this memory yet (aside from some programs leaking memory), but the thought of getting "free" RAM is appealing to me.

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this post was submitted on 02 Sep 2023
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