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submitted 3 months ago by Linkerbaan@lemmy.world to c/memes@lemmy.ml

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[-] ExotiqueMatter@lemmygrad.ml 8 points 3 months ago

I'm not putting my hopes in the republicans, that's a strawman and I'm sure you know that.

I already said the Dems are the lesser evil.

You still didn't give any evidence that they are. You just assert that they are and retreat to pretending like I'm supporting the Republicans when I didn't buy the Democrat's "good optics" as proof that they are less evil.

The evidence is overwhelmingly clear the Reps are not simply just unsympathetic but hostile to anti-zionists.

So are the Democrats, have you not seen what kind of things they say about the anti-genocide protests? Have you not seen Kamala's statement about the protests when Netanyahu was visiting? Or all the violent police crackdown that happened under the Democrat's watch since October 7?

You are holding a shitty hand and everyone knows it. Threatening to go all in on the Reps is going to get called every time.

You know what else will get called out? You blatantly lying about what I said because you ran out of counterarguments. I don't support the Republicans, they're horrible too. It's your unproven assumption that the Democrats are better that I'm criticizing here.

All you can do now is fold, hope your chips go to the almost sympathetic Dems, and start playing the next hand dealt.

the almost sympathetic Dems

Ha, yes. The genociders who are almost sympathetic to the peoples they're genociding. Again, no evidence, just faith. "The Democrats are the lesser evil, no I won't prove it, you must accept it in your soul that they are the good guys, reject the evidence of your eyes and your ears telling you that they keep doing the things they used to criticize Trump for less than 5 years ago, just believe in the holy blue party!!!!"

The more time passes the more Blue MAGA becomes a fitting title for the convinced Democrats crowd.

[+] Cephalotrocity@biglemmowski.win -6 points 3 months ago

Saying something doesn't make it true. I've done nothing but provide evidence the Republicans are worse, in their own words, if you'd read it. I notice you didn't address that at all. The very fact you say 'no, the Dems are worse' proves you support republicans because at this point it is one or the other. There is no plausible 3rd choice. That is the crux of American politics you fail to grasp and try to conceal by calling me a liar.

Throwing a tantrum because the Dems are technically the ones in power and so you place all the blame on them is weak tea. It's not even close. The House vote Republicans initiated to force the Dems to stop delaying the release of weapon shipments had 16 Dems vote for it, versus 208 Reps. Press releases by Republican Senators calling the Dems "weak Palestinians" in a blatantly racist attempt to belittle their hesitation. What the Fuck more do you need? Them to get into power and start invading Palestine with American troops? Get a clue, come on.

[-] ExotiqueMatter@lemmygrad.ml 7 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

I’ve done nothing but provide evidence the Republicans are worse, in their own words, if you’d read it.

No, you didn't. Once again you're focusing on what the parties and their voters are saying and ignoring what they are doing.

I've already addressed why the article you linked don't prove that the Democrats are less bad 👈 This is what I've requested evidence for, in case you forgot. I don't need you to tell me the Republicans are bad, I already know that.

The very fact you say ‘no, the Dems are worse’ proves you support republicans because at this point it is one or the other.

An other strawman. When did I say that the Dems were worst? I said they were both bad. That's my whole point since the beginning: that there isn't any lesser evil between the two. They are both equally bad, only the optics, the presentation, the aesthetic is different.

Throwing a tantrum because the Dems are technically the ones in power and so you place all the blame on them is weak tea.

It does put the blame on them though. As president, Biden is the chief of the entire US military, he could literally send one e-mail and end all shipment to Israel immediately, he has that power right now he just chose not to use it.

And that's just what the president alone has the power to do. Let alone the entire Democrat party with all the senators and governors that have.

The House vote Republicans initiated to force the Dems to stop delaying the release of weapon shipments had 16 Dems vote for it, versus 208 Reps.

That's meaningless lip-service once again.

If the bill don't pass, they'll maybe do one or two more bullshit pause in the shipments and boast that they're so fucking great and progressive for it even though it doesn't even bother the ongoing genocide in any meaningful capacity for the reasons I explained.

If the bill do pass, they'll get a free excuse to continue to unconditionally support Israel while getting to pose as great progressives for the even cheaper price of simply crying crocodile tears on TV and social medias about the bill, while not actually doing anything against said bill.

In both cases they get their voters (you) to berate everyone about the Democrats just because they didn't vote for a Republican bill they at best feel neutral toward.

Press releases by Republican Senators calling the Dems “weak Palestinians” in a blatantly racist attempt to belittle their hesitation.

Yes, the Republican don't care if you see them for what they are while the Democrats are scrambling to convince their voter base that their evil actions somehow don't makes them the 'bad guys'. Again, nothing new, and nothing that contradict my position.

If you have two racist KKK members uncles coming to Christmas eve, would you say that the one who at least shut up during dinner is better than the one who vomit racism on the table, or that it doesn't matter because at the end of the day they are still both KKK members and you should kick out both? I say the second option.

What the Fuck more do you need? Them to get into power and start invading Palestine with American troops? Get a clue, come on.

They won't do that. The American military know they would lose an open war in the region and that if they lose it would be the end of Israel. I know that Trump is a dumb fuck, but he's not alone, there are corporations, handlers and generals behind him who won't let Trump wreck Israel by his stupidity.

The only way the US would send the army is if Iran, Hezbollah and Yemen attack Israel first, in which case the Democrats would sent the army too.

Your argument sits on what ifs with no basis in reality.

[-] Cephalotrocity@biglemmowski.win -5 points 3 months ago

Your argument sits on what ifs with no basis in reality.

Okay you are clearly refusing to face facts. Whatever the Dems do, the Reps say 'they should have done more'. You are fixated on the Dems being the ones signing solely because they are in power when the Reps ENTIRE FUCKING PLATFORM is that Israel needs more support. You aren't arguing in good faith and just repeating the same tired 'Dems did bad stuff tho' instead of acknowledging that the Reps would absolutely do worse, in their own words, supported by their own actions, happily. This unwillingness to get beyond past wrongs to see how you're own myopic actions only make things worse is a running theme with the Anti-Zionists so I guess in a way this is my fault for trying to educate the unwilling.

Don't listen. Keep sawing away at that nose. You aren't worth arguing with at this point unless you agree the Reps outright say they want to do more for Israel than the Dems have and admit the only reason they haven't is solely because they aren't in power. We'll just have to wait for the Rep leopards to be voted in and start eating your faces. At which point the metaphorical screams of pain will be little consolation.

[-] ExotiqueMatter@lemmygrad.ml 5 points 3 months ago* (last edited 3 months ago)

Okay you are clearly refusing to face facts. Whatever the Dems do, the Reps say ‘they should have done more’. You are fixated on the Dems being the ones signing solely because they are in power when the Reps ENTIRE FUCKING PLATFORM is that Israel needs more support.

None of the facts you presented show that the Republicans would do worse.

Of course they're saying the Dems aren't supporting Israel enough, the Reps' whole electoral strategy is to whine about the Democrats and blame them for everything they think is wrong. Just because they say the Democrats support Israel less than them doesn't make it true.

Again, the Democrat's actions show clearly that they are unconditionally supporting the genocide with every resource they have.

You aren’t arguing in good faith

I am though.

I go through every argument you made point by point, and explain point by point in detail why they don't convince me, the problems I have with them, my perspective, so that you can come with better more convincing arguments.

That's arguing in good faith.

But instead crafting better arguments to counter the points I raised you just keep repeating over and over that the Dems are better without ever demonstrating it. So far you've given just 2 sources, of which only the second was relevant to my main point, and no actual argument of your own as far as the subject matter is concerned.

I dare suppose that this is because you don't actually have any answers to the many points I raised, or if you do you're certainly not showing it.

and just repeating the same tired ‘Dems did bad stuff tho’ instead of acknowledging that the Reps would absolutely do worse, in their own words, supported by their own actions, happily.

'Course they say they would do worst. Complaining about the Dems posturing as progressive is their all thing. Doesn't make it true. See first point.

This unwillingness to get beyond past wrongs to see how you’re own myopic actions only make things worse is a running theme with the Anti-Zionists so I guess in a way this is my fault for trying to educate the unwilling.

This is not just past wrongs, this is above all current wrongs, the genocide is going on right now, and the Democrats are supporting it right now.

Again, this point is only valid if you believe that the Democrats are less bad than the Republicans, which I don't believe and which is what I've asked you to provide evidence of, which you didn't do.

Also, your smug attitude since the beginning certainly isn't isn't a sign of good faith on your part.

Don’t listen. Keep sawing away at that nose. You aren’t worth arguing with at this point unless you agree the Reps outright say they want to do more for Israel than the Dems have and admit the only reason they haven’t is solely because they aren’t in power. We’ll just have to wait for the Rep leopards to be voted in and start eating your faces. At which point the metaphorical screams of pain will be little consolation.

I've listened, I've read the things you linked and responded to the points you tried to make with them.

To me, it's you who don't seem worth arguing with or willing to hear a different perspective.

I doubt you even opened any of the many links I gave, or again, if you did, you sure aren't showing you did.

I mean, look at this line:

You aren’t worth arguing with at this point unless you agree the Reps outright say they want to do more for Israel than the Dems

That's the whole thing we are arguing about tough. You're basically saying that I'm not worth arguing with if I don't already agree with you on the thing we're arguing about. If that isn't bad faith, I don't know what is.

And again with that smug attitude, as well as wishing harm on me for not wanting to support your favorite genocider club to top it all, how very blue MAGA of you.

Weather or not you respond, I'm done here.

[-] Cephalotrocity@biglemmowski.win -4 points 3 months ago

Just because they say the Democrats support Israel less than them doesn’t make it true

This, this right here. When someone tells you who they are... believe them.

Like, in what world can you say "just because they say they will be worse, have a huge religio-fascist base they are catering too, and have demonstrated with their declared policies and voting behaviour that they would... doesn't mean they will ahktuallllly be worse". Like, WTF are you even arguing here at this point?

You’re basically saying that I’m not worth arguing with if I don’t already agree with you on the thing we’re arguing about. If that isn’t bad faith, I don’t know what is.

That wasn't what I was saying. I was saying you aren't worth arguing with because you wouldn't even admit they said they would be worse. Now that you have (see previous point), the ridiculousness of your stance is obvious.