view the rest of the comments
politics
Welcome to the discussion of US Politics!
Rules:
- Post only links to articles, Title must fairly describe link contents. If your title differs from the site’s, it should only be to add context or be more descriptive. Do not post entire articles in the body or in the comments.
Links must be to the original source, not an aggregator like Google Amp, MSN, or Yahoo.
Example:
- Articles must be relevant to politics. Links must be to quality and original content. Articles should be worth reading. Clickbait, stub articles, and rehosted or stolen content are not allowed. Check your source for Reliability and Bias here.
- Be civil, No violations of TOS. It’s OK to say the subject of an article is behaving like a (pejorative, pejorative). It’s NOT OK to say another USER is (pejorative). Strong language is fine, just not directed at other members. Engage in good-faith and with respect! This includes accusing another user of being a bot or paid actor. Trolling is uncivil and is grounds for removal and/or a community ban.
- No memes, trolling, or low-effort comments. Reposts, misinformation, off-topic, trolling, or offensive. Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.
- Vote based on comment quality, not agreement. This community aims to foster discussion; please reward people for putting effort into articulating their viewpoint, even if you disagree with it.
- No hate speech, slurs, celebrating death, advocating violence, or abusive language. This will result in a ban. Usernames containing racist, or inappropriate slurs will be banned without warning
We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.
All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.
That's all the rules!
Civic Links
• Congressional Awards Program
• Library of Congress Legislative Resources
• U.S. House of Representatives
Partnered Communities:
• News
their arguments are always emotion based. because of that, it devolves quickly into nonsense.
This is a long one, and I want to start by saying that your comment is a super popular belief. Even so, I think misses the mark a little bit.
Everything in the political sphere is emotions based. 'Murder is bad' isn't some ultimate truth. We care about other people and ourselves. That emotion then leads to the reasoning that murder is bad and should be illegal. Same goes for everything else.
What conservatives tend to do is say 'murder is bad' and 'there is a group that I hate'. They then abandon the truth of what murder statistics tell them and blame it on the out group which justifies the second emotion. They're not wrong because it is emotionally centered (again we all do that). They're wrong because they aren't willing to examine that emotional motivation vs reality.
All of that to say that if we think the problem is emotionality we are probably making similar mistakes even if the outcome is better. To paraphrase a very true statement in Futurama - There is no scientific consensus that life is valuable.
"Climate change is real and man-made" is not an emotion-based statement. "Outlawing abortion worsens medical outcomes for pregnant women" is not an emotion-based statement. "Children do better in class when the school system offers free lunches" is not an emotion-based statement. "Russia invaded Ukraine, not the other way around" is not an emotion-based statement.
Frankly, there are an absolute fuck-ton of things that are simple statements of fact that conservatives delusionally take issue with. Factual reality is not a matter of opinion and I'm not only sick and tired of conservatives trying to make it into one, but perhaps even more sick and tired of 'enlightened centrists' carrying water for them!
I hope you don't feel that was an attack because the fact that it wasn't one will never override the emotional response if you feel it is. If you do feel that way, there is probably no reason to read on. You'll be wasting your own time.
For the record, I didn't say I agree with anything the right puts forward, I don't see room to compromise on things I care about, and if you're talking US I think the "center" is left of the two presidential candidates.
You're absolutely right those are facts (and those facts get totally ignore by people because the are in conflict with their emotions), but the reason you're looking at those stats is also emotion based:
Climate change will hurt blank (too many to list) and I LIKE blank (or am AFRAID of blank) so climate change is bad. Access to abortion is good because I VALUE people lives. All children should have food because I WANT to live in a world where everyone, especially those without agency, can be happy, healthy, and get at least a fair shake. Those are my motivations. How we get there is policy. That's when facts become relevant.
Understanding how we all make decisions based on emotions will help you understand yourself, your motivations, and help you convince people around you that they should also value the same things as you. Practically, you need to go a step further than facts. Ask yourself why that chunk of data is important to you. When you cite it, why would the other person care? Because people are dying? Why does that matter?
There is a consensus that emotions are bad and should be ignored but if you ask people what they want out of life it's all emotions: love, happiness, excitement, fullfillment. We denigrate feelings all the time but we didn't go to the moon for science, it was curiosity and wonder and joy.
Your comment just reminded me that I'm very tired of emotions being dismissed as useless or harmful.
Absolutely! The positive emotions are easily the best of humanity.