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But what about Ukrainian self determination? (lemmygrad.ml)

submitted 2 weeks ago by SlayGuevara@lemmygrad.ml to c/comradeship@lemmygrad.ml

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So Ukraine has turned into a shit show with on the one hand Russia and on the other hand the US and EU. It is clear that Ukraine is merely a pawn in their chess game. This is clear to me.

I try to make it clear to my surroundings too but one question keeps coming back to me whenever it comes to peace talks: what about what Ukrainians want? Should they accept a split in their country with Russia seizing captured land?

I noticed that I do not have a clear answer to this and I wanted to see some input from you guys. Peace talks should imo be the goal as it would be the end to a bloody conflict and it would further (even if slightly) reduce risk for a bigger war. But it is also clear that Ukraine is just a pawn in those peace talks and everything will be decided between the US and Russia. Is it realistic to acknowledge Ukrainian interest in this? And if so, to what extent can leftist support said interests?

Thank you in advance for your answers. It might make it easier for me to go against the warmongering that has been going on lately, and to prevent people close to me from falling for it.

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[–] CriticalResist8@lemmygrad.ml 21 points 2 weeks ago (1 children)

There's a split btwn the Donbass and Kiev. People in Kiev are not the ones getting gang pressed, so of course they want to keep the war going. I'm sorry but if Ukrainians wanted to keep fighting you wouldn't have recruitment officers beating men up and then carrying them into vans to take to the front. Besides, what one wants and what one needs is not always the same thing.

Ultimately to answer their question if I was asked it directly I would say that sounds great, Donbass has self determination and joins Russia, the rest of Ukraine can keep getting shelled and destroyed, that will definitely improve the odds in their favor.

[–] cayde6ml@lemmygrad.ml 7 points 2 weeks ago

While I understand your tone and sentiment, I think you are being very unfair towards Ukrainians, even if alot of them brought it on themselves.

For almost as long as the war has been going on, but especially within the past 1-2 years, I've read reports that Ukrainian civilians will often fight back and attempt to rescue loved ones from being kidnapped by UkraNazi militias, and there have bene numerous cases of Ukrainians banding together to kill Ukrainian "recruiters" and conscriptors.