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Israel aims to cut Gaza ties after Hamas defeat
(www.bbc.com)
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this post was submitted on 20 Oct 2023
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That's.. not bad?
It's disengenuous. People complain about Gaza not having enough of its own water or electricity infrastructure and relying on Israel, but up until now Israel has required Gaza to get their permission on any new construction. So Israel have been holding Gaza hostage via water and now they're cutting them off and making excuses for it.
It doesn't help when the government in the region digs up infrastructure to construct weapons with and makes hype videos about it.
Man good point. Glad the Israelis aren't using any weapons that are disproportionately more effective on a captive populace. The prisoners shouldn't fight back against their oppressor through whatever desperate means they have available. Please die and suffer in silence, Palestinians.
I know right. Imagine they used air burst munitions or. Cheaper mass artillery barrages rather than the primary kinetic and precision strikes they use now. It would look like Eastern Ukraine in Gaza.
Ah yes, because the current bombing campaign against civilians and civilian infrastructure has been very humanitarian. So glad Israel has been showing "restraint". Never mind the white phosphorous too, very legal and very restrained.
Do you know how and why wp rounds get used? You mark a target with wp rounds and now it has an IR signature. So your artillery round can be a single "smart" round that hits your target.
Without wp you'd need to send dozens of rounds in to only probabilistically hit your target and if there was unexpected wind or pressure you might need to try multiple times. That would level whole neighborhoods and sometimes would level them as a "miss".
People talk about wp rounds like they're mustard gas or something. It's a wp round per target or it's 10-40 artillery rounds per target.
How about, no rounds per target?
I love how you're debate-lording me on the specifics of how civilians, children and their infrastructure get blown to bits. Even if you could justify it in that way, that shit is still a war crime for a reason.
It's not a war crime though. That's the point. They're not specifically targeting civillians. They're targeting dual use infrastructure.
That's not making the point you intended.
My bad. Imagine civilians killed in the original slave raid weren't Jewish.
They weren't, the first civilian bombing in the conflict is objectively the bombing of a hotel that housed the Palestinian embassy of sorts, killed like 91.
Pointing fingers in this conflict is a bit idiotic, the protagonists are all ultra religious shitheads fucking over huge populations because of story time interpretations.
Details on the hotel bombing?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/King_David_Hotel_bombing
That was in 1946. How many peace treaties and ceasefires have there been between them and the current conflict?
The start of a trend does tend to be earlier than everything that follows.... I'm not sure how or why you think that's a valid point.
Because if any conflict between people, even ones that have been resolved, can be used to justify current violence; there's no concievable violence that can ever be unjustified.
Take your own advice boss.
I am. If the IDF had conducted a slave raid into Gaza I'd be calling on the US to partner with the world to enact regime change and bring the perpetrators to justice.
Bro, gaza is a open air concentration camp where people are routinely scooped up, held without charges and released randomly and indeed some of those people claim to have been at work camps.
https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2021-07-29/ty-article-magazine/.highlight/israel-secretly-detained-innocent-palestinians-in-desert-camps-in-1971/0000017f-e534-df5f-a17f-fffe499e0000
In 1971. Do you have an example from this century? Most Gazans are 18 years old or younger.
People can still read and absorb oral tradition. Most of this dispute is based on shit from 3000 years ago saying 100 years is too far for it to matter is objectively idiotic.
It's not if the answer to it is to conduct a fresh genocide to remediate the issue. There are peace lines from 1967 that are broad enough where a defacto Arab state and a defacto Jewish state could live side by side. And since the mid 1990s it's been primarily Palestinians rejecting that idea on favor of advocating for genocide.
Clearly it did not work because the conflict is still ongoing and has been since like 12ad.
Yes but when peace doesn't work, the weaker party doesn't tend to prosper.
That's not a point, that's a platitude.
Eh, it's a point. Starting an offensive war with a more prosperous, more militarized neighbor is a dumb move on the part of the attackers.
It's not and stop double replying.
It's an incredibly dumb move. Oh let me attack my bigger, stronger neighbor who provides most of of my utilities. Let me use my aid money to prepare flail uselessly fighting them instead of building up my country so I can actually defeat them.
Of in 2004 Hamas launches zero rockets from Gaza, launches zero terrorist acts from Gaza and instead smuggles all that gear into the West Bank and launches the same attacks from there. The whole world would be calling for an end to Israeli settlements in the West Bank and the establishment of the '67 borders there just like was done I'm Gaza.
Jesus Christ. Dude just stop, seriously. You don't have a point, take a nap or at the very least leave the grown ups alone.
Also how routine is it if the last time it happened was 1971?
Oh ii see t's ok to do just don't do it often, gotcha.
That was your characterization of the situation on the ground in the Gaza Strip. That characterization is obviously incorrect. Pointing it out isn't some faux pas.
The issue here is that both sides have historically done evil shit in the region. But since the end of the Cold War, funding for overt traditional war by the Arab side has dried up and as such most of the atrocities done in the name of that war have too. But terrorism on the part of the Palestinians has risen dramatically. And that rise really can't be attributed to Israeli actions.
It's happened literally every day since 1948, Israel didn't even deny it. You've clearly not read much into the matter.
Palestinians are Arabs and I think that's where we stop because you're clearly just trolling and aren't quite aware of what you speak on.
You gave one example of it from 1971. Since 1971 there have been numerous peace agreements, cease fires and summits that were all designed to create a functional 2 state solution in the region and peace between Israel and her neighbors.
Correct, and Palestine is not the one breaching at the moment, Israel is. The settlements broke treaty and continue to let alone the war crime of walling in a population, cutting supplies and bonding them day and night often in areas Israel know are meant to be safe zones.
Stop simping, they're both shit, it's both their faults so stop already.
What treaty? The Palestinians backed out of the Oslo Accords that would have ended these settlements and Gaza was a unilateral action by Israel. Since then Hamas took over the strip and wholesale murdered the PA there. Agreements have been between Israel and the PA and Israel and Hamas.
They were illegal prior to the Oslo accords too.
You're trying real real hard to simp for Israel but you don't seem to have an actual point aside from "Palestine bad Israel good."
may you source that?
Dude, your like 40 comments into a conversation no one cares about using a different username is just as obvious as using your regular username.
i'm not an alt of mwguy if that's what you're getting at. I sort by new comments and enjoyed this chain, but I wanna know more about the oslo accords.
https://foreignpolicy.com/2023/09/13/oslo-accords-1993-anniversary-israel-palestine-peace-process-lessons/
thank yooou, i'll read through this later! want me to respond when i'm done with it or?
Palestine never agreed to the Oslo Accords. And this fight is taking place in Gaza, instigated by the government of Gaza which has had zero settlements since Israel forcibly removed all the settlers in 2004/2005.
I didn't bring up the fucking Oslo accords! You did! At least keep track of your bullshit argument. Also there are settlements there right now, Israel doesnt deny it so stop simping.
What treaty made them illegal?
Sweet christ, the Oslo accords.
Are we really at the point where you need the same answer twice even though the rest are in writing directly above?
Palestine didn't agree to the Oslo Accords. They've never been in force.
Sweet Christ you brought up the Oslo accords.