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this post was submitted on 06 Feb 2024
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politics
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I don't remember calling the Democratic party leftist or progressive. I said we need to make it more progressive by primarying those members that block progressive policy, and put the party in a legislative position to enact said policy. This means removing Republicans at absolutely every possible position.
If you have a better idea I'm all ears but I'm not really interested in hearing about how much the Democrats suck when the Republican party is a literal domestic terror cell. There are good progressive people within the Democrats party. A shit load of them. Just because they aren't currently in control doesn't mean the party is a waste of time and it doesn't mean we can't take control. Defeatism and refusal to look at this shit strategically is exactly why progressives don't have enough power.
We can take the quick path, let the GOP destroy everything and rebuild from the ashes OR we can put in the work and grind out a better life for everyone over a generation. You can't have both. If someone wants to let the GOP sacrifice all the people it will sacrifice in order to have that first option, they are welcome to join the GOP. They have no business being a progressive.
Eta: how did the rail strike end up working out? They continued working behind the scenes and got them a lot of what they wanted? Oh yeah that's right. So the result was a pay increase they asked for, a good portion the sick days they asked for, and our economy didn't get smashed. All while the GOP opposed literally ANYTHING to help. Sure, the Democrats are the enemy here. https://www.npr.org/2023/02/10/1155763336/freight-rail-workers-union-paid-sick-leave-bernie-sanders-csx#:~:text=One%20of%20the%20largest%20freight,into%20additional%20paid%20sick%20time.
Expand on that please. There are 12 rail unions. What is the minimum number of sick days every member of each union has?
Honestly I think you're larping as a progressive. Like I'm not telling you not to call yourself that but defending a president for blocking a strike and not calling out anyone who voted for Biden in the 2020 primaries as a selfish piece of shit is indistinguishable to me from typical moderates. Lip service has done nothing for us.
Yeah larping as a progressive while going up and down Lemmy talking about ways to move progressive causes forward. Definitely a moderate here. What I have a problem with is progressives who feel the need to kneecap the cause by focusing on shit talking the Democratic party nonstop (completely ignoring every solution that doesn't involve the expansion of mass death and poverty by electing conservatives) and killing everyone's motivation to fucking fight.
Tell me what solution you are offering. I have laid out a specific electoral strategy for progressives to gain control and actually enact progressive legislation. What's your solution? Fight both parties simultaneously and lose? That's exactly what we've been doing.
There's even a perfect real world example: look at the GOP. Right wing elements have spent 40+ years grinding moderates out of their party and actually enacting policy. The Tea Party/MAGA/Nutjobs didn't just get control over a couple election cycles, it took DECADES. Now they have complete control of the party and have the power to make the crazy shit they want the party platform.
Yes my personal feelings would prefer that the stroke happened and we shut everything down until the assholes in charge got the message. I am never in favor of blocking a work action and would prefer every single workplace be unionized/worker owned. My exact position was "nationalize it all". But if I need to make a strategic concession to put myself in the position to make significantly more progress in the future, I don't think that's an unreasonable position. If you do, maybe you don't care about progressive causes as much as you think and would rather feel good about yourself over helping people.
I think I'm good here. Hope you have a good day and that anyone who reads this conversation really considers what I've said.
That's the same plan that's been in place for decades. The needle hasn't moved. Biden is to the right of Clinton. And you refuse to consider any alternative that comes with a hint of risk.
I say again, your lip service has done nothing. You have accomplished nothing. You will continue to accomplish nothing. And worst of all, you're fighting those of us who could actually make some changes.
"You won't consider alternatives!"
Won't provide any alternatives or explain how any of what they are doing is productive whatsoever.
"You're fighting against those of us wanting to make changes!"
Won't explain what those changes are, how they want to make the changes, or even talk about a strategy.
Talk about "lip service". Holy shit that's all you are. Thank you for the productive conversation. Have a nice day.
Here's the alternative:
If he refuses we refuse to vote for him in the general election. In addition, we begin describing anyone who voted for him in the 2020 primaries as a selfish piece of shit. Make people embarrassed to admit they did that.
Amplify the general strike plans in 2028. Continue pushing anti-work sentiment. Bring U.S. productivity down.