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submitted 10 months ago by L4s@lemmy.world to c/technology@lemmy.world

Pika Labs new generative AI video tool unveiled — and it looks like a big deal::The new Pika 1.0 tool comes after a $55 million funding round for the generative AI company and is a big step up in AI video production.

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[-] archomrade@midwest.social 81 points 10 months ago

There's a lot of "AI is theft" comments in this thread, and I'd just like to take a moment to bring up the Luddite movement at the beginning of the Industrial Revolution: the point isn't that 'machines are theft', or 'machines are just a fad', or even 'machines are bad' - the point was that machines were the new and highly efficient way capital owners were undermining the security and material conditions of the working class.

Let's not confuse problems that are created by capitalistic systems for problems created by new technologies - and maybe we can learn something about radical political action from the Luddites.

[-] Even_Adder@lemmy.dbzer0.com 28 points 10 months ago

I recommend reading this article by Kit Walsh, a senior staff attorney at the EFF if you haven't already. The EFF is a digital rights group who most recently won a historic case: border guards now need a warrant to search your phone.

AI training isn’t only for mega-corporations. We can already train open source models, and Mozilla and LAION have already commited to training AI anyone can use. We shouldn't put up barriers that only benefit the ultra-wealthy and hand corporations a monopoly of a public technology by making it prohibitively expensive to for regular people to keep up. Mega corporations already own datasets, and have the money to buy more. And that's before they make users sign predatory ToS allowing them exclusive access to user data, effectively selling our own data back to us. Regular people, who could have had access to a competitive, corporate-independent tool for creativity, education, entertainment, and social mobility, would instead be left worse off and with less than where they started.

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[-] Subverb@lemmy.world 25 points 10 months ago

I've been saying for a year now, generative AI is going to foster a resurgence in stage theater. When movies are all 100% AI with no humans in them, we'll want to see humans act. That and "organic" movie labels.

[-] Sasha@lemmy.blahaj.zone 23 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Cool, another step in the ruining art with AI saga

These are all short clips because they look like ass if you get enough time to actually look at them. But even still, can people just stop with this shit?

Let people do the one truely human thing ffs.

Edit: Let me be clear, AI has good uses. My only argument here is that generating art is not one, especially when the training data is stolen and used for profit.

[-] ElBarto@sh.itjust.works 20 points 10 months ago

No one is stopping people from making art, lazy people will use this to do things they want, but artists will make art because that's what they do.

[-] Sasha@lemmy.blahaj.zone 41 points 10 months ago

I'm more concerned about the fact that shitty companies will use this sort of thing to put graphic designers out of a job.

This isn't good progress. Even soulless corporate bullshit puts food on the table for someone, soon it'll just make another company a bit richer.

[-] zazo@lemmy.world 13 points 10 months ago

Look I'm not supporting mega rich assholes extracting even more from working people, but would you use the same argument for textile weavers and the Jacquard loom? Sure a lot of people lost their jobs at the time, but most, if not all, respecialized and we got computers in the end so would you say it wasn't good progress? 🤷

[-] Sasha@lemmy.blahaj.zone 10 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Except that this is entirely unecessary, and doesn't create a product we need, and it's certainly not one I want.

I want to support people, I want people to do beautiful incredible things. I don't want a higher production rate of souless art statistically generated by taking the work of thousands of people without their consent, for no good reason.

Replace CEOs with AI, that would be good progress.

I also mentioned in another comment that this technology has some very very good uses, I am convinced creating art is an evil use. I'm a big fan of projects like Talon Voice, you can donate voice samples to help improve their language model to help people who struggle to use a computer with their hands. It's amazing stuff and I love it.

[-] zazo@lemmy.world 19 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

See, that's the crux of the argument I feel. You can't have one without the other, you can't have voice generation for the mute without that technology also displacing voice actors in the process.

That's why I think the Luddite approach doesn't work, we can't forcefully break the machines that are capable of so much good because they're also capable of so much bad.

Instead we should focus on helping those that are most negatively impacted by their existence, while supporting everyone that is already being positively affected by them. (like the UBI mentioned in my other comment)

PS. Totes down for replacing CEOs with AI and distributing their salary among the workers

[-] Sasha@lemmy.blahaj.zone 2 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

I can kinda get behind that, but only if it's done right (which I'm absolutely convinced it won't be, thanks to history).

Even just paying the people who lose their jobs, and helping them transition to other work is bad because voice acting is probably a dream job for a lot of people. We also have to ethically source training data, and I don't really see that happening. After all, who would want to contribute to losing their own job?

If we could do all that, I think we can agree as a society to protect those jobs instead. I legimately think we can have only the good, but I understand that doing so requires a fight. I'd much rather fight for that than lay down and accept the worst possible option.

Edit: I'll add further, that this is probably already happening, just for the CEOs. They have the power to create tools capable of replacing them, and to prevent them from replacing them.

[-] zazo@lemmy.world 5 points 10 months ago

That's a good attitude to have and I'm not advocating for putting down our arms and waiting for big tech to steamroll us all.

But as I've mentioned elsewhere, the people making the AI models are fully aware they are contributing to a technology that will take away their own jobs, because they think that it will create other, even more interesting jobs in the process. (see trad artists swearing off photography in it's early days because it was "mechanical and soulless", only to realize it's creative potential years later)

My advice would be to continue being aware of the negative history of things, but don't let it blind you to the positive aspects either.

[-] Sasha@lemmy.blahaj.zone 3 points 10 months ago

I don't understand your argument.

I'm in no way convinced that this will lead to new cool jobs, and I have never heard anyone suggest how that could happen. In all honesty, I'd hate to lose my job as a dev and suddenly the only option in my industry is now "debugging AI mistakes."

If you want to create cool new jobs, how about doing it without disregard for the people you're hurting? That's entirely possible, but the current system doesn't care about people, it cares about money.

If we saw the potential in these tools, and decided as a society to just let the machines do all the stuff we don't want to do, and we all got to do whatever meaningful beautiful things our hearts wanted, then sure. But that isn't happening. The system isn't broken so it won't fix itself.

"Maybe something good will come of all this pain" is a bad philosophy, imo.

[-] zazo@lemmy.world 4 points 10 months ago

But like, it will happen anyways. You can't stop Musk from shoving Grok down everyone's throats and firing 80% of his work force to replace them with AI drones.

If we saw the potential in these tools, and decided as a society to just let the machines do all the stuff we don't want to do, and we all got to do whatever meaningful beautiful things our hearts wanted, then sure.

Yes, literally this, my argument is literally we use all our efforts to fight for this, as making something beautiful out of a shit situation is literally all life has and I feel always will be.

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[-] andros_rex@lemmy.world 9 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Textile weavers still exist, they just get paid even less and live in third world countries. “AI” is the same - a lot of the training is done by underpaid folks living in Kenya and Tanzania. They have to label the gore and CP so that the “AI” won’t use it. Post traumatic stress disorder is pretty common…

[-] PopOfAfrica@lemmy.world 5 points 10 months ago

Like... That was bad too. What we need to do is ditch capitalism before we automate everything.

It doesn't function if nobody has jobs.

[-] BrianTheeBiscuiteer@lemmy.world 4 points 10 months ago

Advancements like the loom usually just affect one industry (yes, there are ripples in the whole economy) and it's not like we got that, the printing press, the internal combustion engine, the computer, and the telephone all at once. AI, if properly trained, can do nearly any task so it's not just artists that are in danger of becoming obsolete.

[-] rambaroo@lemmy.world 2 points 10 months ago

They've already been doing that

[-] echo64@lemmy.world 13 points 10 months ago

Capitalism optimizes for lazy over good. Who's going to be able to pay rent as an artist in your dystopia

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[-] PopOfAfrica@lemmy.world 9 points 10 months ago

All it means is that at art as a career is dead.

Guess we want everyone working in retail or something

[-] Peanutbjelly@sopuli.xyz 3 points 10 months ago

That's already the system outside of creating what rich people want. An entire team of artists creating boardroom directed art is much less art to me than a single creative using AI to bring their personal vision to life.

Hopefully individual artists can do more with these tools, and we can all hope for a world where artists can be supported to have the ability and freedom to create apart from the whims of the wealthy.

Starving artist is a term for a reason. Technology has never been the real problem.

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[-] burliman@lemmy.world 20 points 10 months ago

This is not the way to look at this. Stop thinking this stuff will replace human art. Until we can simulate a human in the machine (not there yet), art will always be by humans because it is a human endeavor recognized and appreciated only by humans.

These things are tools for a human to use. And like any tool that is used in the hands of the casual or the lazy, it will become very banal indeed once the shininess wears off. With your same outlook you could tell Adobe to stop improving the digital brushes in Photoshop, because art is only for humans.

[-] bionicjoey@lemmy.ca 9 points 10 months ago

I think a good analogy is clipart, or those horrible corporate memphis/algeria graphics. They look awful, but they are just good enough at illustrating an idea that many companies will use them rather than hiring an artist. The thing is, corporations almost never want art. They want illustrations.

[-] bionicjoey@lemmy.ca 14 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

AI doesn't generate art. Art is about using media in order to convey a perspective on the world and to illicit emotions from the audience. What AI generates is simply the media itself. It isn't capable of having the point of view or life experiences needed to create actual art.

[-] banneryear1868@lemmy.world 6 points 10 months ago

People forget art isn't just a product it's an activity people do.

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[-] glowie@h4x0r.host 12 points 10 months ago

We were only meant to be wage slaves /s

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[-] hubobes@sh.itjust.works 11 points 10 months ago

This is not the death of artists but of studios. When creating movies will become cheap, movie studios will be the ones becoming unnecessary. But artists are the creatives who feed these tools and who now can create content on their own.

[-] realharo@lemm.ee 4 points 10 months ago

This is from over a month ago.

[-] Catoblepas@lemmy.blahaj.zone 4 points 10 months ago

Seeing people go gaga over all this AI trash kind of makes me convinced that most people just… do not see? Not that something is physically wrong with their vision but it’s like most of it doesn’t even register, even more so than what I thought was the normal baseline of inattention to details.

Are people just constantly distracted and not really engaging with media? Only watching or looking at things on small screens? The result of decades of cuts and devaluation of art education? Literally just being happy with whatever garbage is in front of them? It’s a mystery to me.

[-] KeenFlame@feddit.nu 26 points 10 months ago

The ooohs is mostly about how fucking far it has come so quickly. You must see how this technology is a pretty fucking big deal

[-] burliman@lemmy.world 10 points 10 months ago

They don’t see and don’t really want to see. Typical technophobe responses rooted in fear and insecurities.

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[-] Grimy@lemmy.world 13 points 10 months ago

What a condescending view point while bringing nothing to the table but insults.

I see a technology that will break the barriers necessary to get into animation and movie production, finally paving way for indie companies in the domain. It will elevate art in all domains, bringing us more interesting products and features.

[-] Peanutbjelly@sopuli.xyz 3 points 10 months ago

God I want some large projects by independent teams. It's impossible to do anything without a sponsor, but this might be what we need for smaller groups to create wonderful complex works of art, instead of cookiecutter boardroom content machines that currently flood almost all available commercial artistic spaces.

Can't wait to see how the tech develops. It's be curious to do VR experience recreations of my dreams through AI dictation.

Modelling, rigging, animation and the like are all coming. Imagine walking around a world being crafted and changed as you describe each element to be exactly what you are looking for.

I think it would capture more artist intent than the unnecessary interface of archaic tools that create an artificial interface and challenge between you and your vision.

Especially if you've damaged your digits, or otherwise lack digital dexterity.

But change scares people. Especially ones who have put in effort to conform to the current economic system corporate art creators.

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this post was submitted on 02 Jan 2024
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