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submitted 11 months ago by throws_lemy@lemmy.nz to c/technology@lemmy.world
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[-] voodooattack@lemmy.world 103 points 11 months ago

Legacy hardware and operating systems are battle tested, having been extensively probed and patched during their heyday. The same can be said for software written for these platforms – they have been refined to the point that they can execute their intended tasks without incident. If it is ain't broke, don't fix it. One could also argue that dated platforms are less likely to be targeted by modern cybercriminals. Learning the ins and outs of a legacy system does not make sense when there are so few targets still using them. A hacker would be far better off to master something newer that millions of systems still use.

Tell me you know nothing about cybersecurity without telling me you know nothing about cybersecurity. Wtf is this drivel?

[-] ooterness@lemmy.world 55 points 11 months ago

Simple solution: Don't connect it to the Internet. Hackers hate this one weird trick.

[-] voodooattack@lemmy.world 32 points 11 months ago

And said trick ends when an attacker manages to socially-engineer their way in. (But maybe they’ll drop floppies instead of flash drives around the block this time)

[-] yesman@lemmy.world 24 points 11 months ago

You really think that infrastructure IT is dumb unless it can brush off a Stuxnet-like attack by the CIA and Mosad? Most RR traffic signals in the US are run with mechanical logic, physical switches connected to circuits closed by steel wheels on steel tracks. Do you really want a "move fast and break things" tech bro to update all this stuff for us?

All kinds of infrastructure uses ancient software because it's reliable. Updating it just to protect from hackers causing damage is likely to cause that damage unintentionally while doing little to protect from hackers anyhow.

[-] Linkerbaan@lemmy.world 9 points 11 months ago

It must be updated sometime or risk being archaic and unmanageable. Chances are high they are paying insane amounts for those legacy mechanical switches you mention.

The actual logic is usually very well portable to a more modern ecosystem.

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[-] arc@lemm.ee 10 points 11 months ago

They could socially engineer their way in regardless of some machine being MSDOS or not. Basically if they can gain physical access to the device, or convince somebody to do something with the device it hardly matters what it was running since it can still be compromised.

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[-] arc@lemm.ee 31 points 11 months ago

It really depends if these systems (that appear to control arrival boards) are on a network or not. If they're not, then there is minimal risk to leave them the way they are. Somebody would need physical access to the devices to do harm. If they are on a network then that's a pretty big deal, but some attacks could be mitigated against by tunnelling and/or additional packet filtering to ensure the integrity of messages.

Continuing on a railway theme you should be FAR more worried all the devices that run up and down the side of railway lines - PLCs that talk with each other and operations centres to control things like lights, junctions, crossings etc. If they're more than 5 years old then chances are then all that traffic is in the clear, and because these things live in boxes by the railway line, it wouldn't take much to break into a network and potentially kill people by running two trains into each other.

[-] silver@lemmy.brendan.ie 16 points 11 months ago

the job was advertised as being remote.....

[-] arc@lemm.ee 11 points 11 months ago

The job might be remote, doesn't mean the system is remote. For all you or I know they want somebody to reverse engineer the protocol of this thing, which could be some weird board & driver that hooks into an old PC so they can switch it out for something else.

[-] bane_killgrind@lemmy.ml 14 points 11 months ago

It's in the job description, remote access is available via a repurposed laparoscope robot and webcam placed in front of the original terminal keyboard and CRT

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[-] miss_brainfarts@lemmy.blahaj.zone 15 points 11 months ago

they can execute their intended tasks without incident

Now if only the Deutsche Bahn could do that too

[-] mlg@lemmy.world 12 points 11 months ago

Lmao they don't know all the exploits people learn first are the brutally insane and easy stuff that works on outdated machines like heartbleed and eternal blue.

[-] maness300@lemmy.world 10 points 11 months ago

What exactly is the issue? Everything mentioned is true.

It even goes further when you consider how newer technology often incorporates more technology, which means a greater attack surface.

Tell me you know nothing about cybersecurity without telling me you know nothing about cybersecurity.

Oh, the ironing. Sad how you have >100 upvotes.

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[-] starflower@lemmy.blahaj.zone 84 points 11 months ago

Misleading title: SIEMENS Mobility is looking for said Windows 3.11 admin. NOT the German Railway

[-] massive_bereavement@kbin.social 31 points 11 months ago

Deutsche Bahn is the circus and Siemens in this case the clowns.

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[-] ColeSloth@discuss.tchncs.de 8 points 11 months ago

If the system can't run perfectly on its own by now.... I can teach them how to play the snakes game on it.

[-] InvaderDJ@lemmy.world 81 points 11 months ago

Imagine both the annoyance and job security having to manage MS-DOS and 3.1 systems for a railroad would entail.

[-] theangryseal@lemmy.world 34 points 11 months ago

I would love it so much. I’d feel right at home. I miss sitting in my room and learning everything I could about DOS. That was the best time I ever had with computers.

I once built, setup, and maintained about 20 computers for a Christian school for free just because I loved doing it so much.

I wish I still had that enthusiasm for tech.

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[-] Syndic@feddit.de 13 points 11 months ago

Frankly that's nothing. In the worst case a train won't start, which for DB really isn't something unusual. It's far more disturbing how the whole global financial market sometimes rely on code that's still written in COBOL.

[-] maness300@lemmy.world 10 points 11 months ago

rely on code that’s still written in COBOL.

Does this really matter? It's more of a maintenance issue than a functional one.

It all gets compiled down to binary, anyways.

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[-] MeanEYE@lemmy.world 12 points 11 months ago

Well, DOS is open source now. And that old hardware was quite reliable. Fewer moving parts, I'd expect fewer things to break.

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[-] LiveLM@lemmy.zip 25 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

Ooh, someone is about to make BANK!

[-] GlitchyDigiBun@lemmy.dbzer0.com 24 points 11 months ago

Some retired old fart who can't be bothered to learn fancy-schmancy Web 2.0. Rock on like it's '93

[-] ripcord@lemmy.world 12 points 11 months ago

Or a middle-aged fart who did learn new stuff but remembers the old stuff too

[-] Railing5132@lemmy.world 8 points 11 months ago
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[-] Evil_Shrubbery@lemm.ee 24 points 11 months ago

10/10 would install Doom on it.

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[-] PanArab@lemmy.world 23 points 11 months ago

Migrating to FreeDOS might be feasible for them.

[-] RizzRustbolt@lemmy.world 23 points 11 months ago

At least it's not windows 8.

[-] kby@feddit.de 22 points 11 months ago

Remote? Do you connect yourself over telnet or what?

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[-] AlmightySnoo@lemmy.world 20 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

Not gonna lie, part of me wants to relive the SoundBlaster and DOS extenders era and watch stuff with QuickTime. Tinkering with config.sys and autoexec.bat was quite fun back then.

[-] Dyskolos@lemmy.zip 14 points 11 months ago

Was it really FUN or is it not just nostalgia? I would not reaaaally want to fiddle with the autostart-crap again. It often took soooo long. Even with those auto-optimizers...

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[-] R3tl3f@feddit.de 17 points 11 months ago

Thats the reason, why they have Problems to find drivers (If you know, what i mean) 😜

[-] yoz@aussie.zone 16 points 11 months ago

Sign me up if you're paying $300k+

[-] reinar@distress.digital 12 points 11 months ago

lmao, 60k eur tops. wages in Germany suck ass, earning at least something is possible if you are running independent consulting or climbing corporate ladder, having some unique expertise or going extra mile as an employee is pretty much pointless.

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[-] pastermil@sh.itjust.works 16 points 11 months ago

Do I get to move to Germany for this?

[-] Syntha@sh.itjust.works 13 points 11 months ago

You might, actually. Provided there is no available EU applicant.

[-] nova_ad_vitum@lemmy.ca 12 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

There are probably many people in Japan with this skillset given that they're only now getting off disks for certain government processes.

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[-] xavier666@lemm.ee 16 points 11 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

Why use MS-DOS? Why don't we just re-write it in Rust?

Edit: I should have mentioned /s in my comment. It's never a good idea to rewrite a mission-critical software.

[-] Mamertine@lemmy.world 11 points 11 months ago

The fact they're still running on dos is a clue that either they can't figure out how to upgrade or they don't want to upgrade or they simply won't allocate the budget to upgrade.

It generally boils down to money. Shops like that are toxic. They somehow don't have the budget to keep their business afloat, means you're not getting a raise.

If you take this job, you're obsolete. Getting the next job will be tough. You're interview at the next potential role what did you do at your current role? I ran dos on 30 year old machines. Interviewer: I'm sorry, but we need someone with experience in Windows ME.

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[-] toofpic@lemmy.world 14 points 11 months ago

We're maintaining and developing OpenVMS OS, and both we and our customers need Cobol, Fortran, and other half-dead languages coders.
Many large companies maintain their old systems and use them for production or data processing purposes. Sometimes it's too expensive to migrate off, but im many cases "it just works"

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[-] admin@sh.itjust.works 13 points 10 months ago

I know a guy fitted for the job. He's well versed in MS-DOS, Win 3.1, 3.11 etc. Hell, he's even fluent in German, but he's due a hip and knee replacement this month...

That's all I'm gonna say.

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[-] maness300@lemmy.world 12 points 11 months ago

That's really fucking cool, if you ask me.

[-] fne8w2ah@lemmy.world 9 points 10 months ago

Let's hope the salary is decent.

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this post was submitted on 30 Jan 2024
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