I thought the UK already has nukes what the hell does this even do?

THIS IS WHAT'S HAPPENING IN XINJIANG THAT CHINA DOESN'T WANT US TO KNOW!!!

WHAAAAAAAT. Okay that's wild, especially considering that I had originally put just Irish but changed it to scots-irish because I thought I was leaving them out 😭 😭 . Please do tell more, and why there's a distinction.

3. Yeah fair enough with the exceptionalist attitude. I think its less intentionally to be "The One" trope as more its myself making sure I actually try to move radicaliztion along in a critical moment of change for the Empire, instead of just keeping it to myself and withering away. I think the attitude stems more from my whimsical imagination than my actual beliefs. Just weird to think about lol. As for being radicalized, of course material conditions with being dissatisfied and interested in history/politics, but what are those conditions in particular? Tons of western leftists have similar interests, but many have stayed on their pro western side, Anti-AES and Pro-NATO. Its seems to be a right time right place for us, but we need to figure out what was exactly behind that setting which allowed us peel back another layer of ignorance and to be able to create a similar situation for other comrades.

Isn't that way more expensive?

I think you answered your question there

You think so? Hasn't their geopolitical position put them in a place of stability? I mean I wish tho 😭

I respect your points, comrade. Like having doubts about any traction inside the core from your own experience; and especially with wanting to move to communist and global south countries where we see physical progress, and of course to escape persecution from with the core.

But for me personally, It feels... wrong to uproot and leave, even if to stay it were in vain. I don't think it necessarily is. I think there needs to be a remnant of the radical left--underground in the worst case--to put up at least some sort of internal struggle in different scenarios that would occur with the Red Star taking over: A. to severely protest any efforts by the state to drag us into a humanity ending war. B. To possibly take over any industry that would be placed back in the core if they couldn't exploit the periphery anymore. C. To protect innocents from any rabid fascist dogs being let loose. And D. of course passing on Communism within the core. Somebody will have to stay in the States. There will always have to be a struggle. Sure the need for life boats will come at some point. But feels wrong for me as a communist to get on those life boats before anyone else. Hell, if instead of me being the vanguard of some revolutionary movement maybe instead my job was to usher as many people to get to safety. Not to mention i don't have the means to leave if i wanted to.

Still tho, i am comfortable with sacrificing my own life. I believe all comrades worth their shit are. Not mention the reason why the Panthers were crushed were because they posed a threat, a real threat of revolution, not because it was false hope. And I would be honored to go out in the same way, if that what it took.

I don't have much else to say that I didn't already, at least not much coming to mind. This thread seems to have come to its natural conclusion, and yes a question of revolution in the US will come up again, as it always does. As I said, if you feel it is best to leave for the AES states and Global South, i respect you. I whether of choice or circumstance will stay here, and will fight for revolution till the bitter end.

Take care, Muad.

So what do you think we should do then? Are there any steps to at least get a foothold in the class struggle? You mention all these problems, but what are the solutions? Are we just at a point where our first steps are to explain and organize? Or just wallow in defeat?

Theres a rise in the Labour Movement, hell the Guardian has stated it here, that there is the largest support of Unions since 1965. And the strike numbers keep going up. The ruling class haven't made concessions yet as the movement isn't strong enough (as of now and which we can change!), plus as the US loses its hegemony on the periphery the bourgeoisie will have to sacrifice more for each sliver of concession!

The point on not being able to cripple the economy makes a lot of sense. But again what will happen as the US loses its grip? Wouldn't the peripheries shift to anti-imperialism effectively work as a cripple to the economy? And as I am getting more educated on the Labour aristocracy i will know more in depth, truly there will be material conditions to swing fully into imperialist talking points. BUT, that is happening anyway so it's more feasible to educate the populace and radicalize them as the conditions worsen BEFORE they turn to the right wing. I toe the Panther line when it comes to the unemployed, as they can be the most radical champions of the working class!

You say the US is the most pro-imperialist and anti-communist country on Earth. That may very well be true, but let's dig into the average American thought process. Americans know for a fact that their country has its own interests against the world. Americans also sympathize with communism, problem is they think it only works in theory. They unknowingly support Imperialism when they see "Evil Putin is invading the innocent Ukraine and Xinnie the Pooh with freedom loving Taiwan!" not because they want to have a total US hegemony but because they see them as imperialists themselves. Surprise, surprise, people don't like wars. While i will admit the escalation in Ukraine is a huge set back for anti-imperialist education, we can use the differing narratives that have been provided by the US over and over again to snap them into class conscious. It would be best with China, as it is an AES state instead of Russia which even takes some leftists convincing to critically support. I believe the socdem youth are ripe for radicalization, after all it will be them and their children to further propagate the truth and organize. While it may seem effective to convince Gen Xers, as they are the ones mainly run things right now, spreading an ideological base within the youth, who are growing up in the time of the fall of US hegemony and the internet, is the most productive use of our efforts.

What will happen with their organized class when the exploitable resources in their hands slip through their fingers? At the moment, They are too organized for a revolution to be successful, but wouldn't they start dividing up the remaining resources at best, and at worst be waged into a full civil war against each other?

The bourgeois democracy is stable, but again only as long as the relations of Imperialism exist to supplement them. You mention that the most politically active people are drained by the theatre of the shit show. So we know these specific people are the type who keep up to date on things and at least try, in their own ways, to be politically educated? Can we not show these people the stability of and Dialectical Materialist outlook? I remember when I was a "lib"--I was pretty disillusioned even then--there were some traces of political thought that made sense. A centralized government that provides for you, to have the ability to reap what you sow in your work, and to have women's full sexual autonomy. Problem was these were all spread out over the "sides" of the aisle. Bernie advocated for the first, but conservatives had pushed the bootstrap mentality, and then the libertarians and liberals advocated the last. But almost all of them advocated for small business owners. Why? It is a way for us to sympathize with our semi proletarian brethren, without endangering the structure of Capital. "Small business owners" was our short breath of class consciousness. Being able to reap what you sow from your own work, while not being crushed down by the big capitalist. It was idealistic, but showing people that they CAN have a better life with out exploiting others made the working class feel content. Now when we open these politically active libs to a world outside Capital, they will start to realize what interests they really have and not limiting themselves to the allusive mystery of "small business owners".

Also I wouldn't say the US has the strongest military on Earth. The most funded one sure, but most of that is kick backs to the MIC. The weapons are known to break, the MIC has a trend of making them "customizable". Most of it goes into its Navy and the Airforce, which can't hold a lot of ground, but is suited for its imperialist ventures. Also Nato's stockpiles are being drained out right now. Now the domestic police are different situation, they are very much a threat. But their crackdowns and abuses will just have sharpened the contradiction. We saw even with Liberal co opting, what massive uproar the Murder of George Floyd caused. And what did the Biden administration do in response to the masses? They increased the Police Budget! This will only further exacerbate the struggle with the Police, and more faith lost in the dems! Organizing in a police state seems impossible, but yet don't we see the massive mobilizations of Palestinians in their struggle against the Israeli state? Communists have always been persecuted, but that just adds to our own struggle!

Your average military members actually don't get paid a lot, they have many concessions but even then that's a carrot on a stick. Its common to hear grunts speak of "You only join the military if you are dumb or if you are poor". Sure the highest members receive great sums of money, but you can't lead soldiers, who joined for the concessions, to fire on people who are fighting to improve the conditions which led them to join in the first place. Not to mention oppressed minorities are overrepresented in the military

This ties in nicely with a secession movement. We know one of the most radical regions in the US is New Afrika. I would imagine many of the soldiers will defect to the side which represents them. Plus many of the training establishment lies in its regions so if the cards are played right, they could hinder mobilization possibilities.

Now I doubt a revolution will happen anytime soon, could possibly be multiple decades. But what I want to instill is revolutionary optimism. Sure I am young and I am naive, but if we don't act like it's possible then it will never happen. Id say Morale is the greatest factor for us in the States. Our conditions will continue to worsen, that will make the populous revert to mask off imperialist war mongering. You are right, us comrades in the States are drastically outnumbered, and are painted as crazy lunatics who bash their head into a wall over and over again, thinking that will fix all the world's problems. But we must hold our heads high and proclaim our communist beliefs to the masses. Yes, at first they will take everything you say as a grain of salt. Yes, they will start repeating debunked propaganda. Yes, we will be putting a target on our backs. But isn't that what we signed up for when we called ourselves Communists? Our talking points will be put into the attic of their brains, collecting dust. But when that moment happens--and I know you know the moment as we all have experienced it as MLs--when every little sense of liberalism is put under inspection, and all the theory taught to you through other Communists struggle is squashing that liberalism out of frame; Your brain just clicks. One day those liberals who denied your input to be nothing of value, will come back to you asking to lead them along the path of revolution. After all we have to challenge their world view, how can they learn if they are unaware of the possibilities?

Now what if we benefit from imperialism too much to be radical? Even if thats the case it's not an end all be all. Was Engels unable to be radical from his class interests? What about Zhou Enlai. Hell what about you and I? We have happened to be radicalized in the most anti-communist State in history. Are we special? I don't know about you, but I am not. No but think about it; We are radicals in the place where your material analysis says it should be near impossible. I find that... hopeful. Even in the strongest most allusive bourgeois state, class consciousness seeps through. It is beautiful, hope. One thing stronger than fear.

TLDR: Revolutionary Optimism, lol

No but Muad, I respect you comparatively older comrades who have paved the way for the younger people like me. Thank you, sincerely. I would still be a Western Leftist or god forbid a lib if it wasn't for Lemmygrad. :)

(This is pretty unorganized and will need much editing, but its basic kernels of my analysis of the potential of the US. It doesn't really answer OP's question of ideological revolution, but i am placing it here as people are discussing the feasibility of a US revolution)

Unlike others I don't believe the US will be the last place to have a revolution. I would instead say it will be the place with the sharpest class struggle.

Why do I say this? When I think of de-radicalized populations I think of the Nordic Countries; They have wide social safety nets, benefit from imperialism with little guilt,--As they are "peace loving" countries who "disagree" with the US, but will never take any action.--and have defanged and normalized "Socialism". In the ole US of A; Social safety nets are little to none, we know full and well where our tax dollars go to, and we have only recently opened our eyes to what Socialism is and what it could be. These get more and more apparent with the younger generations, who by the way, will be the ones carrying out the revolution. It's easy to look at boomers or Gen Xers and think the population is too scared to approach socialism with an open mind, but the youth poll high for socialism. Granted they don't know exactly what socialism is, but that is great for us. They know capitalism is bad, and they also know about the Red Scare and will distrust what the US says about socialism (if we can help them walk through the logic it's pretty easy to get the youth to even sympathize with the soviet union!)

In the States, sure you can find the de-radicalized labor aristocratic and typically white "middle class", but you can also find some of the most exploited or demonized members of society; Whether is it is the Indigenous Americans, Black population, Undocumented Immigrants, Immigrants in general, and the Queer community but especially Trans. I would also add the Asian American community who typically have higher incomes, will experience more and more hate as the West loses its influence to the East. Especially Chinese, we have seen what anti asian hate crimes look like at beginning of the Pandemic, and that is without the West even acknowledging the total rise of China! Women with their dwindling rights will become more and more radicalized as the Dems have gone mask off. While Neurodivergence has been heavily normalized with the internet and now TikTok, we still face hardships of the cut throat capitalist system with not being the "ideal workers"--not to mention our thought processes leading us to class consciousness.

While many of these groups may overlap, there is still a nice chunk of the population we know will have radical tendencies--and this is even without mentioning the poor white cis het men!

There are a lot of material factors that agitate the US population, what is needed is the ideological base to guide them. There won't be a revolution soon, but what there needs to be is a massive ML foundation laid out during these times of upheaval. While we give libs a lot of shit, most Americans aren't bigots. If you are worried about hardline Trumpists, they are a minority, a loud minority, but also a minority that is great at alienating the majority of the population. As the country moves farther right, people will look for those voices who stand adamantly against them, and that is us.

If you are considering the actual actions of the revolution here are things to think about: Gun culture has made arming ones self a pretty simple venture. The country itself (I would also add on Canada as it will fall along with the US) is huge with inefficient communication systems and geographic features such as the Rockies, Appalachia, Sierra Nevada as mountain ranges, the deserts sprawling the Southwest, and hell the Mississippi and its extensions splitting open the States, not to mention Canada and Alaska's frozen mountainous terrain and the former's swaths of taiga and tundra, make mass scale deployment of an organized army difficult. That is if the army even wants to fight its own people. The Pentagon has said something as a sliver of concessions like Free College would drastically lower recruitment, so imagine what a worker's revolution would do! Plus marginalized communities are disproportionately in the military, and I would imagine they would heavily sympathize with an ML revolution, especially with the case of New Afrika!

I will leave it here for now, feel free to challenge me or ask my further thoughts. Keep in mind these are just seeds of a further analysis, I just needed to dig them up and plant them somewhere.

And before assassinating Zelensky

What will the West say after they liberate the DPR?

Yeah, I feel like California would be a good place to consolidate our MLs in America. It has lots of Bernie supporters, Worsening conditions for the poor (price of houses, car centric, huge race disparity, etc) a discontent with the current government. But also geographically strategic, it's huge, the rockies act as a buffer from the rest of the US, far away from Washington, and would be close enough to get aid from China. Economically it would be a huge dent in the American bourgeoisie, and it could be swing to the back of the legs for the eventual demise of the Empire.

Being in a red state, I also agree our country folk have good values just misinformed. I have an idea to make an ML party, but it's ambiguous in its iconography as not to scare off the public. All we need to do is gain their trust with actions, and describe our mission without the "scary" words then we can rope them in to Socialism.