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this post was submitted on 30 Sep 2024
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Don’t forget to vote third party or not at all because the Democrats aren’t perfect or because electoral college or voting day is a Tuesday…. s/
Dont forget to not hold democrats accountable for anything so they can move 6 more steps right and normalize all the Republican corporate shit you claimed to be against 10 years ago.
This comment made around 8AM Saint Petersburg time. Morning comrade!
Which candidate that has a chance of winning the election in November do you think Americans should vote for?
Wanna bet their answer is "no"?
Not them but I think the answer is very obviously "not Trump".
Everyone should vote for "Not Trump" and it seems that more people agree than not when even his own party wanted a guy with former brain parasites than him.
There is really some lamenting though that the bar is set so low and the Democrats seem to be happy to not even try to jump over it but take the win on not being Trump.
It could be an amazing strategy to run on a platform of helping and pushing change instead of telling tired people they will keep things the same.
Its obvious it needs to be "Not Trump". But I wouldn't expect people to be happy about voting for the equivalent of the 2000 Republican Party in spirit here in 2024 when people not wanting that anymore is how the Republicans got Trump in the first place. People are gonna get burnt out and disenfranchised on no change.
It doesn't mean they are right to burn it all down but people commit suicide for shitty reasons too.
The only "not Trump" that has a chance of winning is Harris.
Voting for any other "not Trump" actually helps Trump. You might as well just not vote.
Well only true if they weren't a Trump supporter voting 3rd party.
People walking out of his rallies and falling asleep at them does not help Trump.
I get that Harris is the only person with the current backing up there to win properly against him this election but if you literally take a look at your math there and say someone that votes third party would be better by not voting at all you are just trying to silence people that disagree with you rather than let them have any voice.
Voting for third party when they wouldn't have voted at all is not the same as helping Trump and you need to stop being so scared of Trump you keep bullying those that would with that false equivalent.
I am not trying to silence anyone. People are free to do what they want. I stand by my position that voting for anyone but Trump or Harris achieves nothing.
Voting third party in modern history has never achieved anything and there is no one anywhere close to the popularity of Ross Perot, who came closest.
Telling people that if they don't vote with you they shouldn't vote at all is pretty telling of who you are and what you want. You said it above and you barely have changed your stance to hide your disdain.
And now you saying people can only other vote for Trump since he's the other representative of a deeply problematic 2 party system?
If people want to voice their displeasure but not necessarily achieve something, I'm not yelling at people that they are worth less than nothing when they do it. And I definitely don't want to push the idea that Republicans have to only vote Trump because it's his party.
People can vote for whomever they like.
I have no idea why you think I have the power to stop them, but I do not have that ability.
I also do not have the ability to yell at anyone over Lemmy.
You are being ridiculous.
Just because you put on a veneer of post indifference doesn't make reality any different.
You can vote for whoever you want. That doesn't mean you don't get to face the very clear negative consequences for how you vote.
If you want to make the choice to not vote for the only candidate that can beat Trump, that's your call. But dont for a second think you're immune from criticism for not wanting to help beat him.
Yeah, that's how the world works. I don't think people who don't vote in line with the Democratic Party care about not being in the same good graces to be considered one of them.
But pushing the false equivalence that somehow not voting for Trump is the same as directly voting for him is foolish and not a good tactic to swing them into voting with the party.
These are anti authoritarian people. As in literally don't like being told what to do. And you can't fix a negative with a negative. People need to feel inspired themselves to do the right things. Otherwise people are shockingly self destructive and will cut off their nose to spite the fact.
You are free to bully people that will say they voting a way you don't like too but don't think it will be productive is my point.
I did not say that, nor would I agree with that statement. 3rd party/non voters ARE supporting Trump. They are not providing as much support as someone who actively votes for him, but because of the way FPTP voting works, their actions absolutely benefit the GOP more than the Democratic Party.
I haven't told anyone what to do. I've explained the results of not voting/3rd party voting, that's all. If they don't like those results it sure sounds like they shouldn't do the dumb shit they're proposing.
"By doing X, you are causing Y" is not bullying. That's absurd.
Alright last comment cause I got stuff to do. But you literally just said you don't agree that not voting for Trump is the same then said it's practically the same. In literally the next sentence.
Just because someone isn't voting for your desired candidate or your opposition doesn't mean they are supporting the one you have issue with. It literally doesn't work that way. They might not be helping you but somehow it only impacts one side? Cause there isn't a net positive for it anymore? That doesn't equal a positive for the other just literally a neutral "wasted" vote because sure it is.
If you can drive a car and not support climate change than this can be true as well. Attaching a moral equivalence to measure people against for a desired outcome is just you telling people they don't matter and are "other" for not being with you. You aren't say8ng what will happen cause if someone votes third party... They vote third party. That's it. You just don't like it so you push that it equates to something you see as worse.
Pushing fake math to appease your own mind is not exactly great. And you can lament them not helping but saying they are doing something you view as immoral because you view it a negative as a positive for the enemy is creating a wedge that doesn't need to exist.
Not going to continue this if you insist on this bad faith bullshit. Have a nice day!
Blue MAGA out here going strong
Weak ass bullshitters want to piss in everyone's Cheerios to make themselves feel better. Can't even engage without intentionally misstating me.
Okay? That doesn't change the fact that I can't force anyone to vote for anyone or not vote or do anything and I don't have the ability to yell at someone on Lemmy.
Also, for someone who complains about people being silenced, you sure want me to shut up.
"Hey that sure sounds like unproductive bullying"
OK cool whatever. But you are totally being reasonable and pedantic now so nothing you have done or said before matters. Got it.
I said nothing about bullying, nor did I try to bully anyone. Why are you lying?
You acted like the victim by saying I wanted you to shut up when that wasn't said by me and now are doubling down on the victim for being told something you don't like. I really don't care.
You say the most bizarre and untrue things.
By quoting you?
Are you a troll or that sheltered that you are able to alter every interaction in your head to make yourself the only good person?
Some would call that narcissistic behaviour or borderline personality disorder.
I mean... you sure seemed like you didn't want me talking about what I was talking about, but maybe I was wrong about that.
Of course, what with my narcissistic behavior and/or borderline personality disorder, admitting I'm wrong about something is impossible, so now I'm confused.
And still playing the victim while ignoring that none of what happens in your head is what is happening in real life and I have participated in the conversation the whole time.
I think you are wrong to talk the way you do. And assume things that are self affirming than being honest with reality.
You literally are still using sarcasm and avoidance as a shield and haven't met the conversation once but used the feeling of being right to be your moral compass.
Yeah I would still call you a narcissist.
I honestly have no idea what you're talking about, but you sure do like insults.
No you just like to say stuff and don't listen to others. So yes I'm sure these all sound like insults.
Oh to have your free time and ignorance.
If I'm ignorant, shouldn't you want to educate me rather than berate me? Is this how you think ignorance should be dealt with?
Oh cool, if you want to be educated, well then reread this conversation from the beginning where I try to have the conversation you refuse to have. Then when you get to here and haven't changed start over and reread the conversation from the beginning. And when you get to here and pretend to care again start from the beginning where I tried to have this conversation.
Okay, well at the beginning, you accused me of silencing people and yelling and both of those were lies, so I'm not sure where you want me to go from there.
I mean, I'm gonna vote for Kamala, but Dems ain't movin' left, let's be honest.
"Vote for my candidate or your worse than Republicans"
Much democracy, so freedom. If y'all spent half the time working against Republicans that you do attacking anybody left of Biden maybe we could have meaningful change.
Why are you putting words in my mouth? That's highly dishonest of you, especially when I said nothing even remotely like what you're putting in quotation marks.
(It's "you're" )
And FYI, I'm probably left of your beliefs. I just understand the existential threat of another Trump presidency. I live in the Real World, where compromise and Progress are better than holding out for perfect and getting nothing, or worse...
If We The People (left, center, and the extremely rare Never-Trump Republicans) are somehow able to keep him and his dangerous revenge tour intentions and Project 2025 schemes out of the White House, there's another timeline where the United States becomes a failed, fascist Oligarchy. Don't say it can't happen here, because history tells us it absolutely can. In fact, we've never been closer!
Kamala Harris is great! Perfect? No. But at this moment in history nothing is more important than keeping Donald Trump from subverting the democracy of our entire country...
Let me guess: you've been calling your representatives, demanding voting reform and an end to "first-past-the-post" and holding your votes hostage at all times, not just in an election year... Right!??
I know you think you have some big gatcha here, but I actually do those things. Go on and keep rewarding democrats for sprinting further right and dumping whatever scraps they promise on Day One.
Well, as it stands, intentionally or not, you're encouraging making people's votes (not for Trump) not matter.