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this post was submitted on 11 Nov 2024
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I'd like to see more statistics so I can argue the effect of this with more conservative people in my family. Unfortunately statistics like "deaths related to abortion laws saw 56% increase from 2018 to 2022" when Dobbs decisions was made in 2021 isn't exactly a strong argument to show that this decision is leading to deaths and not related to the effects of covid.
And before you argue with me, trust me you can't convince them that a fetus isn't a life. They will treat a fetus the same as a newborn baby. So unless I can prove to them that the law hurts mothers who want the baby I won't convince them the law is unjust, and abortion = murder.
I need to show increase in maternity deaths, unviable births, miscarriages leading to death, forced births leading to deaths. I need to show how this law actually hurts people who want children.
This isn't an argument about choice. The idea that a woman can terminate an unborn baby at will cannot be used as an argument here. There is no consensus that a "collection of cells isn't a baby". Remember that the same people who want to ban abortions also want women to have sex with a partner that is willing to have a child, unplanned pregnancies being part of that journey.
I just narrowly won over that contraception should be medically available.
Let's steelman the position and say 100% fetuses are complete people equal to any other person.
Then the issue becomes, does the government have the right to force you to use your body to support another person?
If I stab you in the kidney, and you'll die without a kidney transplant, can the government forcibly remove my kidney and give it to you? Obviously not.
Exact same thing with abortion. The whole argument of wether or not a fetus is a person is irrelevant. Nobody can be forced to use their body to support another person.
Here's the problem: they view a clump of cells as more of a human than they view a woman as a human 🙃
The problem is not the fact that fetuses are people or not, it's Napoleon's "some animals are more equal than others" from Animal Farm. They view the fetus as MORE important and deserving of more rights and care than the person carrying the fetus to term.
Yes, literally. I promise you, I have met a scary amount of conservatives who think women are only good for making babies and cleaning the house.
You should get all the stats you need in the upcoming years. Not sure it will make a difference though.
I mean...they would just be ok with them dying and suffering horribly.
No. No they're not. They are not evil. This is the problem with the entire debate on abortion. Not everyone that is pro life leans with destroying care for the living. It's not a black and white argument. Unfortunately the law is black and white which is leading to deaths. Deaths that they need to understand is the cause of the Supreme Court decision
I need help with this data too for similar reasons.