16
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
this post was submitted on 18 Jan 2024
16 points (63.3% liked)
Antiwork
3568 readers
1 users here now
A community for those who want to end work, are curious about ending work, want to get the most out of a work-free life, want more information on anti-work ideas and want personal help with their own jobs/work-related struggles.
The new place for c/antiwork@lemmy.fmhy.ml
This server is no longer working, and we had to move.
Active stats from all instances
Subscribers: 2.1k
Date Created: June 21, 2023
Library copied from reddit:
The Anti-Work Library 📚
Essential Reads
Start here! These are probably the most talked-about essays on the topic.
- The Abolition of Work by Bob Black (1985) | listen
- On the Phenomenon of Bullshit Jobs by David Graeber (2013) | listen
- In Praise of Idleness by Bertrand Russell (1932) | listen
c/Antiwork Rules
Tap or click to expand
1. Server Main Rules
The main rules of the server will be enforced stringently. https://lemmy.world/
2. No spam or reposts + limit off topic comments
Spamming posts will be removed. Reposts will be removed with the exception of a repost becoming the main hub for discussion on that topic.
Off topic comments that do not pertain to the post at hand may be removed if it is deemed they contribute nothing and/or foster hostility at users. This mostly applies to political and religious debate, but can be applied to other things at the mod’s discretion.
3. Post must have Antiwork/ Work Reform explicitly involved
Post must have Antiwork/Work Reform explicitly involved in some capacity. This can be talking about antiwork, work reform, laws, and ext.
4. Educate don’t attack
No mocking, demeaning, flamebaiting, purposeful antagonizing, trolling, hateful language, false accusation or allegation, or backseat moderating is allowed. Don’t resort to ad hominem attacks against another user or insult other people, examples of violations would be going after the person rather than the stance they take.
If we feel the comment is uncalled for we will remove it. Stay civil and there won’t be problems.
5. No Advertising
Under no circumstance are you allowed to promote or advertise any product or service
6. No factually misleading information
Content that makes claims or implications that can be proven false or misleading will be removed.
7. Headlines
If the title of the post isn’t an original title of the article then the first thing in the body of the post should be an original title written in this format “Original title: {title here}”.
8. Staff Discretion
Staff can take disciplinary action on offenses not listed in the rules when a community member's actions or general conduct creates a negative experience for another player and/or the community.
It is impossible to list every example or variation of the rules. It is also impossible to word everything perfectly. Players are expected to understand the intent of the rules and not attempt to "toe the line" or use loopholes to get around the intent of the rule.
Other Communities
Server status for big servers http://lemmy-status.org/
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
All of those can exist without an employer skimming from the top, also none of it is free, as op mentioned in their previous comment - it's all been paid for with money you made for them.
Idk why but it seems devs are incapable of comprehending theory.
Show me where that has worked?
Many places. A good, quick example is a Worker Co-op, which is more stable, with higher rates of employee satisfaction, than Capitalist businesses. FOSS is another example, the site you're using is a rejection of Capitalism, which ruined Reddit with ads and horribly unpopular yet uncontestable changes like the API bullshit.
A Worker coop is in fact a Capitalist business. They produce goods sold for a profit to return that as wages. FOSS only exists because the folks coding it are sharing what they made for their own benefit and only able to do so as they are otherwise gainfully employed. Thus Capitalism is the engine which allows FOSS to exist. Well done disproving your theory. That is indeed the first step to discovery.
This might be a bit of a shock to you, but none of what you said is correct.
The definition of Capitalism is not selling goods for profits to pay wages. Capitalism specifically requires Capitalists. If, like a Worker Co-op, the Workers equally share ownership of the Means of Production, it is not Capitalism and in fact becomes closer to Market Socialism, or even Syndicalism.
Worker Co-operatives can compete with Capitalist businesses in a market, absolutely, but that doesn't make the entity itself Capitalist.
Secondly, FOSS exists regardless of the employment status of those who contribute. FOSS can exist based on donations, a student hobbyist, someone who relies on their spouse, or so forth. To attribute FOSS to Capitalism is like attributing the Civil Rights movement to the KKK, because the KKK allowed for the horribly racist conditions that forced black Americans to March for justice.
You have done nothing to disprove anything, except perhaps the myth that you may know what you were talking about.
Sorry, been in a Farmer coop. We were 100% Capitalist and profit based. Sold our production with the intent of making a profit. You are simply ill-informed as to the definitions of the terms you toss about. I also have provided Code for FOSS projects which I only could do as a result of being gainfully employed.
Your fantasy is based upon nothing more than your naivete.
Capitalism isn't about selling for profit, precisely none of what you said contradicts it being Socialist.
Capitalism vs Socialism is about who owns the tools. If you were in a co-op with equal ownership among all of the workers, then you were in a Socialist entity, regardless of it being done for profit or otherwise.
Your contributions to a Socialist project while employed at a Capitalist institution does not make the project not Socialist.
Pray tell, what do you think Socialism and Capitalism are? You aren't using common definitions in the slightest.
Socialism is workers owning the means of production, which only exist to be owned by them if they were first built which won't happen at any scale under Socialism since it shall be a shit show of "I get mine now and you get the next one which never gets made". How many 3d printers you think are going to get made when it takes hundreds of man hours to make one and the majority of the folks working on it get nothing for their time?
And, yup, a farming coop is a Socialist structure operating a Capitalist venture. Works fine for such things at small scale manual production but instantly falls apart when you start needing to transport it. The freight company needs gasoline and doesn't have the storage for your grain you want to trade in return for them shipping it to the tractor manufacturer.
Oh, I know, next you'll say that you still have money or some other legal tender to represent the goods such that you don't have to ship them to the folks making the tractor. So you'll need to have banks to come in to handle the "trade slips" or whatever you call it to avoid calling it money. And you now have to have a Gov. to assure the banks don't cheat everyone...
Guess what? That is how we got money and Capitalism in the first place. Oops, you've simply made Capitalism with more less efficient steps. Your "common definitions"(not in use by anyone any where) leave a lot of reality and history out of the consideration.
Wow. Only the first phrase of your first sentence was correct. Why do you think people would get nothing for their time? Worker co-ops are examples of Socialism, by your very own definition.
Capitalism isn't banks and money, lmao. Capitalism is exclusively the economic model by which capital Owners pay non-owner workers wages to create commodities for sale, ie individual ownership of Capital instead of Worker Ownership.
The very fact that you have no clue what you're actually talking about and keep spouting whatever pops into your head means you should probably reevaluate your positions and familiarize yourself with leftist theory before you pretend to know what leftists actually advocate for.
Bullcrap. A worker co-op can easily exist outside a capitalist context.