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Missouri man fatally shoots his mother at home after mistaking her for intruder
(www.theguardian.com)
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this post was submitted on 10 Mar 2024
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That's a direct quote from your article so where does the "37,500 break-in assaults" number come from when it's 3x higher than what your source lists?
Furthermore,
Meaning you're 4x more likely to be shot by someone than assaulted during a burglary
https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2023/04/26/what-the-data-says-about-gun-deaths-in-the-u-s/
You're wasting your breath. Gun owners are extremity selective about the statistics they choose to care about.
If they're supplying them, they're usually bullshit and if they're demanding them, it's usually sealioning. Their fixation on numbers vanishes the moment those numbers don't say what they want.
He can vomit up all the numbers he wants but if guns actually solved the problem, America would have the lowest crime rate in the world. Instead, they have crime rates that are practically identical to countries with comparitive levels of wealth and education.
Only in America, there's a layer of murder on top of every crime, because "responsible gun owners" keep arming criminals with their unsecured firearms and dogshit laws.
No need for hypotheticals here, we've got hard examples of stats & studies that either are or aren't bs. Although the only bit I talk about on gun violence is from the GVA, but you're welcome to call them BS if you wish.
At ~20,000/year, it's 1 in 17,500 people. Or 1 in 6,180 households to keep comparisons equal.
The point of the comparison isn't to downplay gun violence, as should have been evident by how I'm arguing an equally-likely violent home invasion isn't something to dismiss.
Specifying assault specifically was a mistake on my part, as I said the math came from the article's citations on all violent crimes experienced by occupants during break-ins multiplied against the year's 583,000 burglaries. Of that 26% number, 18% is assault while 6% is armed robbery and 2% is rape. I'm not sure where the article's 11,000 claim comes from, as that number is uncited and would represent a substantial decrease vs the numbers they have citations for, which showed consistent values year-to-year in the mid-2000s though at a significantly higher overall rate of burglaries at 3.7 million/year. The closest number I can think of would be if they're just counting specifically aggravated assault, which using the cited percentage of occurring in 4.5% of occupied break-ins would come to 10,125 instances in 900,000 break-ins.
And actually, re-reading the article shows the 600,000 burglary number only accounts for 69% of the US population whose law enforcement reports numbers to the FBI, real numbers from the FBI are 900,000 for the past couple years making that number's discrepancy even worse with the math's number of 62,100. I'm not able to find any more recent data on either a % or a hard-number of home invasions resulting in assault or other violent crime victimization, if you have any please share.
Coming at me citing suicide stats in a crime discussion, nice! And not even applying them correctly, using the number of deaths as a stat for being shot at all. I already referenced a more accurate, if still flawed, number by summing injuries & deaths from the GVA above.
Suicide victims aren't even cold before the pro-gun community sweeps them under the nearest rug, desperately hoping that if they're quick enough, nobody will notice that means reduction is extremely effective in suicide prevention.
You're still more likely to be shot by someone, it's just the "someone" might be you.
But it'll never be one of your kids with one of your guns, will it buddy?
Pardon me for not considering actions I have control over in a discussion on the likelihood of violence one doesn't have control over. And again, I'm citing larger numbers for gun violence victims than what they are citing incorrectly.
At 1 in ~2000 odds (10 in 10,000 suicide rate, 50% firearms for ages 10-24), or literally the exact same odds that I'm saying a person should be prepared for based on their consequences, those are absolutely odds I would act to minimize if I lived with a minor or anyone suffering mental health issues.
Just here to point out that it'll never be your home, will it buddy?
You have control over who you vote for. I suspect you don't vote for the politicians who will reduce suicides.
Bernie -> Hillary -> Bernie -> Biden since I've been eligible to vote, so just barely. You realize about 1/3 of gun owners vote left, right?
If a third of gun owners vote in favor of making sure this sort of thing never happens, I'm all for that.
But you seem to be arguing that this sort of thing is an unfortunate outcome of a necessity. Which seems to go against what the people you vote for think and want.
Hillary, who you voted for, wanted to eliminate the Castle Doctrine, which makes this sort of thing legal.
So I think you need to decide whose side you're on.
No, I'm not some fucking lib toeing the democratic party line, and criticizing someone for that is "RINO republican" bullshit with a D at the front. I also think her policy against police abuse of waxing poetic about its tragedies while advocating for further funding is bootlicking bullshit, I think her stance against abolishing the death penalty while downplaying its minimum 4% false positive rate in killing innocent people fueled by a 69% rate of official misconduct and 15% rate of judges overruling jury decisions to enforce the death penalty as "very unfortunate & discriminatory" is blatantly prioritizing bootlicking over actual justice, I don't think her stance at that time to merely reschedule marijuana as schedule II rather than full legalization is sufficient, and her policy of "the cops can have a little stop & frisk, as a treat" is more of the above. And no, I don't support eliminating the castle doctrine or passing duty to retreat laws for one's own home either.
But I'm sure if I instead cited these disagreements as why I didn't vote for any candidate you'd be perfectly understanding, right?
And what about this situation makes you think "this sort of thing" was legal here? The shooter was charged with manslaughter & armed criminal action with a bail of $100k.
Obviously it's not legal to murder your own mother who isn't breaking into your home.
But it is legal to murder someone who is breaking into your home.
Even if the only thing they're armed with is the rock they used to break through your window and you can just leave.
Yeah, yeah that's indeed where I draw the line. I don't think a person is morally obligated to ascribe best-intentions to someone breaking & entering (again, they'll be violent toward you 26% of the time), I don't think a person is morally obligated to be a victim of violence in their own home, I don't think a person is morally obligated to evacuate what is meant to be their safe haven, and I sure as shit don't think anyone else either with a badge or without is coming to be the good guy for you. And as defense, I don't think it is murder.