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Kamala Harris running a damn near flawless campaign, with just a month 1/2 of campaigning. She’s been holding rallies nonstop with Tim Walz & not making her talking points about her race or gender like Hillary. She’s offering expanded healthcare, reinvestments back into public housing, wants to take on corporate greed, protect reproductive rights and chose a pro labor, pro education running mate.

Yet, she’s either barely leading or ties in most polls with a guy that:


Is a convicted felon.

Liable Sexual Predator.

Gets sentenced in November.

Has several more pending cases.

Increased Drone Strikes by 300%. (Joe Biden dosent use drones anymore).

Illegally killed an Iranian General unprovoked with a missle strike.

Increased tensions in Israel/Palestine with the Abraham Accords.

Wants war with Mexico (his words).

Tried to coup Venezuela.

Will bend the knee for Netanyahu’s potential war with Iran.

Lowered the corporate tax rate from 35% to 21% (lowest in history).

Obvious tax cuts for the rich.

Told people to drink bleach during the pandemic.

Is the main driving force for America’s current division.

Constantly attacks marginalized groups.

Tried to steal the 2020 election (Find Me 11,000 votes in GA).

Did Fake Elector Slates to pressure Mike Pence to not certify the 2020 election.

Caused a riot on the capitol that lead to his OWN supporters dying.

Just got washed by Harris in the last debate, was completely unprepared on anything but immigration (“I have concepts of a plan”).

And so much more. So seriously what is it? Is it just the attraction to bigotry/racism? Is it to end “wokeness”. Is it because Kamala is a woman of color? You can’t use the both sides argument like Hilary or Biden, Kamala is the obvious better choice. Could you imagine if Kamala had as much baggage as Trump? The media would lose their minds.

Seriously, how the f*** is this guy still in the race?

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[-] hesusingthespiritbomb@lemmy.world 32 points 6 days ago

This is a serious answer so it's gonna get down voted to hell, but whatever.

There's a huge portion of Americans who are suffering. Their personal lives are kind of awful, they live in communities that are impossible to get ahead and the communities are often that way to due the direct actions of the political establishment in the late 20th and early 21st centuries.

Above all else, these communities don't really feel heard by the liberal establishment. They feel as though their concerns are dismissed by what they see as the powers that be. They feel that their anguish is belittled as a personal failure, and often downright mocked. They also feel as though a lot of entities that fucked them are liberally coded.

To these people, Trump is the guy who makes those people seethes and tells them to fuck off. That endears them to him and offers extreme loyalty. They often dismiss the allegations against him because at some point every single conservative has been implied to be a disgusting person in popular culture.

Ironically I think a lot of Trump's worst actions solidified the support of his base, because of where America has been at since his political ascendency. The US culture war has been raging for a decade now, and both sides have a habit of taking extreme positions while vilifying their opposition. That is naturally going to cause people to get more aggressive, which in turn villifies Trump.

An example I love to use is vaccine skepticism during covid. There were two huge groups of vaccine skeptics in America: rural whites, and black Americans. Both had suffered greatly at the hands of an aloof medical establishment, and both had their suffering ignored. While the Black community's wounds run deeper, the rural white community was fresh off the opioid crisis. They had every reason to be skeptical about big pharma lying to them for profit, because that's literally what happened just a few years prior.

The liberal response to the black community was understanding and outreach. The medical community made a huge effort to reach out to black community members and popular figures in black culture. There was a direct acknowledgement of the medical establishment's bigotry in the past. There was not a culture of shame for people who did not choose to get vaccinated. This was also reflected in news articles and social media posts.

Their response to the rural white community was basically the opposite. The medical establishment's outreach was extremely limited by comparison. The opioid crisis was written off as a failure by the Sacklers as opposed to any systemic issues that the medical establishment needs to address. Vaccine skeptics were repeatedly and aggressively shamed, with open discussion in regards to simply enforcing vaccination via mandates. Basically every MSM article talked about how the vaccine hesitancy was a character flaw. Social media went even farther. Not only did they call conservative vaccine skeptics things like death cultists, but there were forums dedicated to making fun of antivaxxers dying of covid. People would post private Facebook posts of people they knew by two or three degrees of separation, and then liberals would more or less celebrate their demise. You even had the return of the word "sky fairy" on reddit to describe when these people prayed to God.

Trump, for his part, encouraged people to get vaccinated. He stated multiple times at his rallies that vaccines could end covid, and that they were making him look bad by not doing so. He was, at his own rallies, booed so loud he had to stop talking. He quickly changed his tune.

A consistent trend in liberal circles is the belief that they have complete moral and intellectual authority, as well as the belief that this authority gives them the ability to treat people who don't conform like shit. I'm pretty sure I'm voting for Harris, but there are also times where I felt like I should just say home. It's completely fucking insufferable, and ironically has a ton in common with evangelical christian politics that dominated the US in the 1980s. So long as that mentality is there, you'll have people like Trump gaining undeserved support.

[-] forgotmylastusername@lemmy.ml 12 points 6 days ago

There's a difference in attitude when they keep doubling down and proving their critics right. That's how misbehaved children act. Except when you're not a child but full grown adults who refuse to budge like when mommy used try to give you that cough syrup you don't want it so you twist and turn your head with your mouth sealed up tight. Yeah of course people are going to laugh at you. People laughing at you on social media is no excuse. What the hell even is this logic. This is not much more than a thinly veiled reddit tier pseudo-intellectual reply. Complete with the "ill be downvoted but", "btw I'm actually voting liberal", and the pièce de résistance using Black people as a rhetorical cudgel.

Btw I'll get downvoted for this reply but whatever.

Look man I don't know how old you are, but this type of comment is what I'd expect a teenager to write. it's not just that you're acting like a massive asshole; You're using insults and arguments that I'd expect a teenager to come up with. It's the sort of argument that only works if the vast majority of people in the audience are already both deeply in your corner and also immature. Otherwise you'd just come off looking like a massive jackass.

Do you have any experience talking to people outside of an echo chamber? How does that go for you?

[-] Narauko@lemmy.world 2 points 6 days ago

And there you go from the moral/intellectual high ground, mocking them as toddlers and saying it's right and normal to laugh and make fun of them.

I can't stand vaccine hesitancy and anti-science bullshit. I've had to deal with this becoming a Fox News thing in my own family, and lost too many people from alternative "Eastern" medicine over "Western" medical science. But the mockery and ridicule only feeds into the Christian persecution complex most of that rural white population already embraces, and causes the wagons to circle.

[-] DozensOfDonner@mander.xyz 5 points 6 days ago

I feel like a common trend is that if people generally showed more compassion for others, quite a bit would much better already. I mean for instance with vaccines, , not immediately vilifying people for not wanting the bacon, but trying to understand why. Also on the other side, antivaxxers trying to not just get pissed but trying to understand the other side. Not sure if I'm now thinking "understanding" or "compassion", but i guess the later would be a first step to not just giving up on people, instead of getting pissed or writing them off like stupid.

But lol not gonna lie that's hard.

[-] jecxjo@midwest.social 1 points 2 days ago

I think it was easier to interact with people who made poor decision due to being illiterate on the topic because they just did the shit to themselves and that was that. Don't get the vaccine, that's fine. But now we are dealing with a world where every single person feels the need to not only speak their mind but scream it as loud as fucking possible.

What's ridiculous is that we now have concepts like "canceling" someone for something they said. That the natural result of saying something stupid or bigoted. In the past people ignored you if you were an idiot or asshole. But now that people think that others should be compelled to listen we keep having platforms for obvious nonsense to be disseminated.

[-] Furbag@lemmy.world 4 points 6 days ago

The culture war has been going on for a lot longer than a decade, it's just only in the last decade or so that it's been amped up to 11 in terms of how aggressive it's being fought. Conservatives are almost always on the losing side of social issues that require a culture shift. Women's suffrage, civil rights, seatbelt laws, anti-smoking laws, gay rights... the list goes on, and the fight is never quite done for some, but they always lose in the end.

The very fact that conservatives are very pro for things like coal mining that liberals are trying to legislate away create strong reasons for some people to hold their noses and vote Republican regardless of how noxious the candidate is. When their livelihoods are literally at stake and the liberal response is "Well you should have gone to college to learn a new skill or trade" it makes sense that they are corralled right into the arms of conservatives. Economic drivers are the most powerful force behind the conservative movement right now, not culture bullshit that deep down they don't really care about. It doesn't help that very few people understand the relationship between "the economy" as outlined by experts and "the economy" as experienced when paying for groceries or filling up their car at the pump. It doesn't matter that conservatives almost never deliver on their promises to fix the economy and often end up sending the nation into a recession, if bad decisions on a national scale lead to temporary relief on a local scale for some, that's what they will remember when voting next time.

Liberals need to be doing more to bring disenfranchised voters into the fold. Educating them without being condescending or dismissive would be an excellent start. Turning down the temperature in politics is not possible without also lowering the stakes, backing off of hardline positions in the short term might be the most effective way of undermining support for terrible conservative candidates.

[-] Hackworth@lemmy.world 4 points 6 days ago

I think this is accurate. But I'd like to restate it.

The Left (as the apparent big tent party full of literal minorities) has been learning to deal with disenfranchisement and the feeling "that their anguish is belittled as a personal failure, and often downright mocked" for its entire existence. Because of a huge variety of factors, the Right is losing some of its influence. They are not handling this well. The Left (being well acquainted with feeling unheard) should have been able to help the Right through this transition. Due to deep seated insecurities on both sides, we are no longer able to help one another as a people. Buckle up.

[-] Clbull@lemmy.world 2 points 6 days ago

This is actually a very good and nuanced reply.

We're going through similar problems in Britain. There are a lot of people from deprived communities that suffered during the seventies (Winter of Discontent, high inflation), had their manufacturing/mining jobs and access to social housing dismantled under Margaret Thatcher during the eighties, were ignored by successive leaders (John Major, Tony Blair and Gordon Brown), then suffered through austerity at the hands of David Cameron.

Meanwhile, the media had been pushing tonnes of hatred towards immigrants and to nobody's surprise, hate crimes against Muslims and Eastern Europeans have skyrocketed. Things are so bad that we voted to leave the European Union in 2016, voted in a corrupt Tory government that pulled us out of the bloc in 2020, and given the trend of our most recent election, it's becoming increasingly likely that we are going to vote in a far-right government by 2029 or earlier.

[-] Nuke_the_whales@lemmy.world 23 points 6 days ago

Trump could be rolled out drooling and leaking brain fluid from his ears and 40% of voters will fully go behind him cause he's a republican. And the "undecided" voters will somehow see it as a strength. By the way, anyone still claiming to be undecided on Donald Trump in 2024 is full of shit

[-] BadmanDan@lemmy.world 1 points 3 days ago

I guess, Trump himself said he could kill someone and they’d still vote for him.

[-] Zink@programming.dev 17 points 6 days ago

Judging by some of my distant acquaintances it’s something along the lines of HURR DURR GASOLINE WAS CHEAPER 8 YEARS AGO. They focus on a global commodity of all things.

Seriously, the only stuff I’ve seen from them that even approaches a policy comparison rather than “lol black lady is a ho” caliber stuff revolves around money. And some of that might actually be a valid discussion if it were correct and if it weren’t for the absurd amount of other issues.

It’s just a low-information team sport, regardless of how insane reality is.

[-] GoodEye8@lemm.ee 2 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

But that doesn't keep him in the race, there are moron candidates with moron voters in other countries but they generally drop out pretty quickly. What keeps Trump in the race is mostly the electoral college but also the first past the post voting. Trump wouldn't have a shot at winning if the electoral college didn't skew the value of individual votes and first past the post effectively limits the amount of candidates you can have.

[-] Zink@programming.dev 2 points 6 days ago

That’s true, but I would amend it to say that the EC and our stupid FPTP system, plus the bias of the senate, are what’s keeping the entire Republican Party relevant.

The rabid and mean stupidity is what is keeping Donald Trump in particular in the race. The establishment might actually like to get rid of him and get back to “money good, human well being bad” like God intended, but they could not get away with it yet.

[-] RvTV95XBeo@sh.itjust.works 14 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

Lowered the corporate tax rate from 35% to 21% (lowest in history).

Obvious tax cuts for the rich.

That's all his financiers hear.

Constantly attacks marginalized groups.

That's all his voters hear.

Everything else goes in one ear and out the other, muddied up with enough "whataboutism" and "both sides" rhetoric from the financiers to keep the voters from actually considering alternative options.

[-] JackbyDev@programming.dev 21 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

Is there any possible way you'd ever vote Republican? If not, remember that there are people like that on the opposite side. You're always going to have single issue voters. A huge example is anti abortion advocates voting Republican. If someone genuinely believes abortion is murdering a baby they aren't going to care how good a candidate looks in a debate.

[-] Soup@lemmy.cafe 14 points 6 days ago

Amerikkkans.

[-] vermyndax@lemmy.world 10 points 6 days ago

I dunno man. I got nothing. I don't understand it either.

[-] madjo@feddit.nl 9 points 6 days ago

Hatred for anything not Republican by MAGA and their brainwashed followers. That's what's keeping Donald T. still in the race.

[-] ErinCrush@lemm.ee 7 points 6 days ago

It's all that side has. Who else would run in his place? Nobody comes close to that sort of name recognition. The Republicans are betting on a culture war to win and who wages that war more than trump?

[-] Trigger2_2000@sh.itjust.works 5 points 6 days ago

While there may be "No stupid questions", there are many, many "Stupid answers".

[-] bastion@feddit.nl 4 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

Everybody will answer "greed, racism, idiocy, and bigotry" or some such rubbish, because morally and overall psychologically, that's the most comfortable answer.

The real thing is somewhat complex, and most people won't buy it.

Of course, part of it is those things, but there's way more going on here, some of it is cultural dynamics, some of it conscious intent. Those specifics are the symptoms, not the disease (though they may be diseases in their own rite).

  • structural weaknesses in the US government, which was barely meant to handle the complexity millions of people, much less tens or hundreds of millions of people. I.e., bandwidth issues. As more people push their views and goals into the system, all of that needs to get governed or implemented somehow. But there is no cohesive operating principle that guides US (and even other western) culture. There is no razor - not even material necessity (staying in-budget, or managing debt effectively) is accepted. There is no means to trim implementation that all parties will be happy with, so things don't get trimmed. They get crammed in, the laws (in the sense of legal structure, not crime) are consequentially self-conflicting, improbable, or impossible to fulfill. This leads to an intrinsically unstable environment, ripe for (and rife with, by all parties) abuse. What you are seeing is, in part, the breakdown of the rule of law. This breakdown can be allayed, to some degree, with authoritarian means, but that only goes so far, even if that authority has a willingness and capability to work with the people as a whole - which none of the active authorities do, anyways, except maybe Bernie, and he's been written off by the authorities because he can't work with them well, and they also have valid concerns that must be addressed. But, in any case, whether centralized or not, this breakdown is to be expected, because the rule of law, unless supplemented with common principle, becomes.. well.. legalistic, and rife with abuse.

  • governance that doesn't match underlying principles: we have no conscious least common denominator. People often point to distinct nations and say things like "see? they are doing X right!", but that nation has a cohesive culture, and isn't dealing with anywhere near the level of cultural complexity that any melting-pot nations are dealing with. What is enforceable must be agreed upon by common culture - or you must sacrifice the reality (though not necessarily the pretense) of diversity, and enforce your way. But that has obvious flaws. Instead, it is better, in my opinion, to enforce sovereignty, which is intrinsically what all the different cultures want, anyways, except that they also want to take control of everyone - which they don't get to do in a system with sovereignty as a basis, except by people ascribing to that culture. What you are seeing, is in part, a breakdown of unity due to a lack of agreement about what can be universally enforced. I.e., the system implemented does not address underlying cultural commonalities.

  • the need to incorporate raw power and personal responsibility into the governing body. Bending the rules, breaking the rules with impunity, changing the rules, explicit and implicit coercion are all possible, and as such, the existing system or ruling party must be able to address these things, and incorporate them where needed, for the larger good of upholding the spirit of the law. This relates to the breakdown of the rule of law, but is more primal: you know raw power must be met with raw power. That power can be of a different form, but it must be effective.

  • unconscious cognition of complex truths: or, in some senses, the "vote of no confidence". People understand, or are at least impacted, by the above issues. They have instinctive reactions against external control, and for good reason, as individual sovereignty is the source of a solid collective. But in any case, many people are aware there is a problem, don't see a solution, and are see no option but to let things burn. This may not even be a conscious choice, but simply an overall feeling - and thus, more powerful and deeply-rooted.

  • genuine mockery and rejection of opposing views. Nobody gets each other, unconsciously, and everyone else treats others outside their worldview like shit, and pretends that doesn't matter. A lot of the left separated from the "Christian" right due to this - only to turn around and do the same thing to the center and right, feeling just as justified in doing so. But it creates real alienation and aggravates the already deep wounds and rifts that exist. One's personal actions, thoughts, and feelings may not seem to matter, but they resound loudly in the whole - and making personal change does, too. For those who are genuinely growing and facing their hearts and minds - my respect.

All of these contribute to Trump's rising and staying power. Of course, he's just riding a wave of unconscious thought, and if it weren't him, it'd be someone else. But people like to fixate on a face.

The actual thing we're trying to do (integrate diversity into a cohesive whole) requires genuine acceptance and support of differing world views (including non-scientific or non-Christian ones - why do I have to say this?). That means that your group, your ideology, must make room for the people who are "wrong", and wish to live their lives wrongly in abhorrent wrongness - though they never gain the right to enforce participation in their culture, above and beyond what is a natural requisite by birth, upbringing, or other dependency.

That is, each person and organization has a sovereign right to rule their own life and the lives of their dependents as they see fit, but does not have the right to force others to use their system, nor to prevent others from abandoning their system and starting their own or joining another. This integrates the very opposite of federation (well, not in the Lemmy sense, which is actually confederation, but that's a no-no-word because some people thought that confederation did give them the right to force others through slavery - but it doesn't).

But Sovereignty Culture isn't simply confederacy, like Lemmy is, but it heads towards the same things. That which can be federal is only that which we fundamentally agree on. The federal must not be used as a means of furthering ideologies, but as a means of resolving disputes between differing ideologies. It can have as much power as the people grant it, and no more - else it loses the people. By making sovereignty a keystone of culture and governance, we intrinsically grant and naturally enforce rights of others, but without placing a burden on others (except the burden of self governance, which you already have, and can't avoid).

[-] Donebrach@lemmy.world 4 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

Because people like my idiot brother think “he trounced that ho in the debate.”

[-] BadmanDan@lemmy.world 1 points 3 days ago

Smh, you should read off what he’s done to him…and tell him Biden did it. Just to see what his reaction is.

[-] MTK@lemmy.world 4 points 6 days ago

Two party system, some would vote for party x no matter what.

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this post was submitted on 12 Sep 2024
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