this post was submitted on 05 May 2025
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SOURCE - https://brightwanderer.tumblr.com/post/681806049845608448

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I think a lot about how we as a culture have turned “forever” into the only acceptable definition of success.

Like... if you open a coffee shop and run it for a while and it makes you happy but then stuff gets too expensive and stressful and you want to do something else so you close it, it’s a “failed” business. If you write a book or two, then decide that you don’t actually want to keep doing that, you're a “failed” writer. If you marry someone, and that marriage is good for a while, and then stops working and you get divorced, it’s a “failed” marriage.

The only acceptable “win condition” is “you keep doing that thing forever”. A friendship that lasts for a few years but then its time is done and you move on is considered less valuable or not a “real” friendship. A hobby that you do for a while and then are done with is a “phase” - or, alternatively, a “pity” that you don’t do that thing any more. A fandom is “dying” because people have had a lot of fun with it but are now moving on to other things.

| just think that something can be good, and also end, and that thing was still good. And it’s okay to be sad that it ended, too. But the idea that anything that ends is automatically less than this hypothetical eternal state of success... I don’t think that’s doing us any good at all.

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[–] Toldry@lemmy.world 12 points 4 days ago

Dan Savage (of the sex and relationship advice podcast "Savage Lovecast") says this frequently.

A short term relationship can also be successful. It doesn't have to end with one of the partners dying in order to be considered good and worthwhile.

[–] Korhaka@sopuli.xyz 5 points 3 days ago (3 children)

Depends on the situation, marriage is something I would see as for life so that absolutely is a failure. The business it would depend, if you are bankrupt that is a failure but if you choose to sell it as you are not enjoying it any more than that is more comparable to retirement.

[–] aceshigh@lemmy.world 4 points 3 days ago

I don’t think it’s personal failure if it entails people/places/things you cannot control. You cannot control the economy, so if it goes belly up and you file for bankruptcy it isn’t your personal failure. You cannot control your partner, so if they start being abusive, it’s not your personal failure to leave them. I think success is being able to adapt to what you can’t control, and failure is not living in reality and trying to make fetch happen.

[–] Ironfist79@lemmy.world 2 points 3 days ago

The idea that two people can be compatible and never change for their entire lives is flawed in the first place.

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[–] dullbananas@lemmy.ca 2 points 2 days ago

Misses the point of marriage, but other than that it's an awesome glimpse into a more sane future

[–] skittle07crusher@sh.itjust.works 10 points 4 days ago (6 children)

On Wikipedia, an article for a deceased person reads, “[The deceased] was,” while an article for a TV show that has ended reads, “The Office is

Feels kinda related in some way

[–] Echolynx@lemmy.zip 7 points 3 days ago

That seems to me more just a linguistic quirk of how English works.

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[–] SecretSauces@lemmy.world 15 points 4 days ago

I think in some cases it's driven by capitalism. Your business didn't make you money forever? Failed. Your books stopped selling and you didn't make millions from what you published? Failed. Your show was good for a couple of seasons, but outlived it's hype? Failed

There are other scenarios line you mentioned, marriage or hobbies, that AREN'T about money. But the ones that involve profit follow that.

[–] orcrist@lemm.ee 7 points 3 days ago

I totally disagree with your characterization. I can come up with dozens of examples of how people don't think that the goal is "forever". That's not to say that you're lying, if you feel it then no doubt your feelings are genuine, but I don't think your feelings are a good reflection of contemporary society at large.

[–] Resonosity@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 3 days ago

Some things I think we want to aim at for our entire lives, and those things are good in and of themselves even if we don't achieve them.

I think getting good nutrition, staying in a healthy state/sustaining or increasing our health span so we aren't sick, exercising so we can still get out of bed every day, seeking novelty and variety in the things we do, exploring new places, learning about the world around us and ourselves, sharing all of these things meaningfully with others on a similar journey, and even defending things that mean a lot to us are some examples of this.

The idea that these experiences must last eternally was something Nietzsche talked about this in his works. He rejected Plato's notion of the Forms as well as many religions' concepts of a life after death - this "other world". To Nietzsche, the good life in this world is defined by how far life can stray from its best moments, and that working through hardships and recognizing that they aren't permanent gives us the power of freedom.

Good times must be accompanied by bad or even mediocre times. Good times lasting forever are no different than bad or mediocre times lasting forever. So yeah, writing that book or making that friendship/relationship can be a good thing. And if those things aren't perfect, we have more reason than enough to make them better. Whether that's work shopping the book until it gets better or starting over with fresh new ideas. Whether that's meeting new people and developing those friendships over time, or leaving them for new friendships when other people don't want to reciprocate. I like to think of so many people wishing for good times to last forever are lazy and just don't want to put in the effort to change, which in my view is the whole point.

[–] Zink@programming.dev 6 points 4 days ago

Such a good way to put it. And I have focused on something similar for myself. Literally everything is temporary.

I tend to be a planner, a saver, the person who never uses consumable items in games, and the person who will avoid using an item they like so that it will last longer.

It’s helped me allow myself to enjoy today more, and spend more of my time doing things I want to be doing.

[–] Comment105@lemm.ee 3 points 3 days ago

While this is true, it stands in contrast to the similar message co-opted to justify or cope with planned obsolescence in gaming. Chess and Odysseus can be good for centuries, so can some mechanical or story based video games.

This.

I would rather have things to end and turn into good memories, rather than having it turn to shit.

[–] 100_kg_90_de_belin@feddit.it 2 points 3 days ago

Forever is a very long time

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