America can only dream of being socialist or communist. Such a confused place that they can’t tell the difference between fascist and socialist
this post was submitted on 23 Aug 2025
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The MAGA turd stains swing back and forth from Fascism to Communism. Fucking hypocrites.
Fascism also implies state control of the economy, so nah this is very in line with historical fascist states.
The Fascist conception of the State is all-embracing; outside of it no human or spiritual values can exist, much less have value. Thus understood, Fascism is totalitarian, and the Fascist State–a synthesis and a unit inclusive of all values–interprets, develops, and potentiates the whole life of a people.
Fascism is definitely and absolutely opposed to the doctrines of liberalism, both in the political and economic sphere. (p. 32)
The Fascist State lays claim to rule in the economic field no less than in others; it makes its action felt throughout the length and breadth of the country by means of its corporate, social, and educational institutions, and all the political, economic, and spiritual forces of the nation, organised in their respective associations, circulate within the State. (p. 41).
-Mussolini https://politicalresearch.org/2005/01/12/mussolini-corporate-state
None of them stand behind anything but money.
I recently cut a new friend from my life, went from normal seeming dude to full trumpism, I guess I just didn't see it before. Told him I don't associate with trump supporters and blocked his number. He said he shouldn't have brought up politics.
No man, be proud of the shit you believe in, don't hide it! You voted for hatred, stand behind it! It's everyone else that's wrong!
Fuck em. Stand up for what you believe in and either receive the hatred happily or reevaluate why you're getting shit on. Being a decent human doesn't cost much at all.
Does not get you control, this is just the government giving money to big corporations which is perfectly in line with actual capitalism (as.practiced, not the fairy tale version).
Real capitalists will also have no problem with the government taking over a failing company, paying off it's debts and later selling it at a loss to them.
Government ownership over industry where they do have direct control would still be capitalism though, as long as commodity production, wage labor and markets exist, since that's what actually defines it. Ownership alone isn't relevant.
Technically you could still have commodity production, wage labor, and markets under other systems such as under market socialism and various forms of anarchism that use markets as an economic driver.
Calling a system something else doesn't make it different, all of these are still fundamentally capitalist. Production remains commodity-based and mediated by markets, labor power stays commodified and exploitative (if not via capitalists, then via the state apparatus or the markets), wealth accumulation remains in place leading to inevitable snowballing monopolies and wealth gaps, etc.
Only by fundamentally changing what things are produced for and how the goods are distributed (for example, instead of for profit we produce for use to fill people's needs) only then does the system overcome capitalism.
This is why democrats are still losing to trump, they can't give any sort of positive vision for the country. They're turning into reactionaries so whenever trump does some bastardized version of progressive policy, they don't say we'll do that but better, they say that's dumb and we won't do it at all. So anyone who wants the current system to change ( a majority of americans) they see trump as the only one who's even trying it.
If Trump says he's gonna bring peace to the middle east, they need to point out how shitty his plan is and how bad he is at negotiating and then give a better plan, not brag about there close connection to war mongering psychopaths in Israel.
If trump says he's gonna raise tarriffs to bring back jobs, they should point out how untargeted and useless they are and put forward a plan to use them in combination with industrial policy to make green industry in America, like China did.
If trump is taking 10% of intel to probably just sit on, they should say we'll use that stake to guarantee workers rights and to keep jobs in America, not call it communism like some reincarnation of Joseph McCarthy.
Dems are also all bark, no bite. Hard to get behind a consistently weak, losing team. We finally got a few "squeaky wheels" hoping to make some change. After Bernie got shafted, fuck DNC too. America is bought and paid for, all higher ups are in on it. They only go into politics to fatten their wallets. Fuck you pelosi and anyone else benefiting from insider trading.
This is the most braindead comment I've read here yet. Google search Democratic Party Platform and you'll find a 92 page document covering everything you pretend to be looking for. Now Google the Republican Party platform, and you'll find it's "Whatever Trump wants at any moment'.
You could be complaining out of sheer ignorance, which is a common feature in today's political environment, when a simple Google search has the answers for the 'do your own research' generation, or you are being disingenuous on purpose to push the Both Sides Same narrative.
Ironically it's a messaging issue. Trump did great with nuh uhing Hillary and just talking up whatever hed do instead rather than saying what it is. The dems need to move to what Bernie did, you scream loudly about what you need done and what the problem is and you tell them that they've been having a hard time.
Ironically yeah, this is an action I would've supported anyone else doing, its just that Trump is so wildly irresponsible and vindictive I suspect hes going to just meddle with the economy on culture war bullshit. Also the whole repealing subsidies that were a great first option before they had the chance to play out
Who gives a flying fuck what you can google? I would have hard time believing them if they were saying it every day on live TV. Some documents barely tied to any politician without loud commitment is not worth the disk space it is occupying.
Your commitment to ignorance is impressive.
I am not, nor any normal person, is gonna read that 92 page platform. I am commenting about the messaging they are giving to the masses, like it or not orders of magnitude more people see these Gavin tweets then there platform and this is what's informing there view of the democrats, and that view is terrible. They are at a 30 year low in approval rating, even with the unpopularity of trump to play off. What do you think explains this if not shitty messaging? Cause I think we can both agree there platform is nominally better then the Republicans, yet your average person doesn't believe that.
And the Republicans did have a platform, it was project 2025 and it was full of a lot of extremely unpopular shit. Did that stop them from winning all three branches of government? No, because no one reads a platform.
So you can't be bothered to read the Democratic Party's platform, their vision, but you have plenty of time to spend leaving excessively long complaints about how they don't have a vision. Gotcha.
I believe a piece of it that real solutions a)take a long time to come to fruition (often decades - solar power was proped up by subsidies for a generation before it became economical on its own) and b)have costs (eg making housing more broadly affordable makes it a worse investment) and many people aren't going to take that shit. Solutions next year at no cost (or only at a cost to "other" people) or die.
So any politician who proposes real solutions that can work can't get votes. Politicians who propose fantasy solutions get voted in over and over, because even when their solutions don't pan out, "at least they are trying."
I agree with you that there are certain issues that will require long incremental complex change that is hard to sell to a populace addicted to short simple sound bites. I also believe there are a lot of issues that can be implemented in a congressional term that can be summarized easily, but dems refuse to do them because it would require large systemic change that there donors don't want. Messages like Medicare for all, free childcare, student loan forgiveness all funded by a wealth tax on billionaires. This is a very popular, simple message you can give to the masses while at the same time laying out those long term complex technocratic plans for those who care.
The dems are only giving those technocratic plans though, and it shows as less and less non-college educated people are voting democrat. We can say theyre just stupid sheep but those sheep are a majority of the population and if we don't cater to them, we'll never win another election.
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The only thing the Democratic Party hates more than Republicans is actual leftists.
Both parties have no positive vision for the country.
Unless money is going into their pockets.
Now you are getting it, they enjoy when you call them nazis, gotta play around that
Yeah, calling the fascist doing fascist things as "socialism" is definitely not something that a party in Germany did in the 1930s.
Why should we care if they like or dislike what we call them? No one is trying to convince the Nazis.
Putting a hammer and sickle next to Trump is an insult to the number one Nazi killers in history.
Socialist are the number one killers and fighters against Fascism in history. And second place isn't even close.
Trump using the government to increase the value of corporations is only "socialism" if you completely ignore everything that Marx or Lenin ever wrote.
This is just more "socialism is when the government does stuff". Zero understanding of class conflict and interest.
For real. Republicans are all for one party state with state owned monopoly corporations.
Fuck Newsom, but his twattering is apparently amusing to some of my very dejected friends who've been in a rut post-2024 election, and that's worth something. Hopefully the combativeness spreads.
Fascists calling eachother communists like this on Twitter while working class people cheer them on for being so funny is just not the future I envisioned or wanted.
I don't have many nice things to say about Newsom but let's not dilute the word fascist into a generic insult eh?
He made being unhoused illegal.
While I like him mocking trump I still don't like him.
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I mean, there are non-fascist neoliberals out there, but this shit is just fascism. If it can happen to the homeless, it can happen to anyone.
That's just liberal bullshit, not fascism.
There are plenty of NIMBY democrats as evidence by all the Dems who are treating Newsom as the second coming of Christ and the presumptive 2028 nominee, despite his disgusting practices Vis-à-vis the homeless.
Fascism is a Far Right, Authortarian, and Ultranationalist ideology that combines a militaristic autocracy, forcible suppression of decent, and a racist social order. By using the term as if it means 'things we hate', then it waters down the actual definition and gives MAGAts who constantly try to turn the word around on us ammunition.
Call it gross, call it late stage capitalism, call it vile, disgusting, cruel, short sighted. Call it sweeping the problem under the rug, call out liberals for supporting it. All of those things are true. It's not fascism though.
Ya. Honestly, I'm getting pretty close to being done with Lemmy at this point. The way to fight extremism is not with different extremism. Between the hyper purity test Leftists, and the AI=evil absolutists, it feels like there's never any room for constructive discussion anymore. If I even ask a clarifying question about someone's views, even one that I could potentially be swayed towards, the response always comes back as some variation of "You're one of them aren't you!"
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I hate Newsom (and neoliberals in general) but man, this is a good one.
I'd really hate if it does come down to him as presidential frontrunner, but his team's tweets have been incredible
From my post elsewhere in response to Trump's post.
That's socialism, right? Maybe not because the workers won't own the means of production, the government will. Which is communism. Well 10% communism? Well, starting out at the introductory rate of 10%. I'm sure that Trump will demand more in the future.
Remember when Republicans talked about the free market, government not picking winners and losers, free trade, etc? They are being conspicuously silent on the government taking over part of a major company. Imagine if Obama started buying stakes in companies? You don't have to. The federal reserve did it via quantitative easing during the 2008 crash. They pumped trillions into companies to keep them afloat during Obama's term and the Republicans that knew about it had a hissy fit. But they are all quiet now. Nothing to say. It's okay for the government to have a little corporate ownership as a treat. Even though they called it fascism for years.
That’s socialism, right?
The Marxist definition of socialism is that the government owns the means of production. That definition prevailed during the Cold War when you had such socialist countries. Communism is a utopian state which is promised to come after socialism. It's the system of a post-scarcity society where you don't have property because everything is abundant. The state withers away because it is no longer needed. Basically, it's a society like in Star Trek. In Marxist thought, the development is: feudalism->capitalism->socialism->communism
Of course, it's not wrong using the term "socialism" more loosely.
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