Privacy has become a very important issue in modern society, with companies and governments constantly abusing their power, more and more people are waking up to the importance of digital privacy.
In this community everyone is welcome to post links and discuss topics related to privacy.
much thanks to @gary_host_laptop for the logo design :)
I think you still can have a Linux phone with GNOME, there's a GNOME version for mobile.
After all, what is a smartphone? Just a convenient computer that can make calls.
Linux + GNOME will do that for you.
This is from 2022 and it looks pretty good to me: https://blogs.gnome.org/shell-dev/2022/09/09/gnome-shell-on-mobile-an-update/
Linux phone will hopefully become realistic thing.
But the more this goes on the more my attitude has changed. I now do far less on my phone, I'm more careful about what I expose to it. As a result I spend very little time on it and that's been great.
To be clear I hate what's happening, it's just been working out to improve my time.
This is America. We don’t do privacy and consumer rights. You will freely give all your data to a tech company where you are the product up for sale.
This is the internet, not America
As of right now, it's looking like GrapheneOS will be unaffected, and Google has yet to lock down the bootloader. So this should remain a valid option for at least 2 years.
Other than that:
Honestly there probably isn't any good, long-term solution. Personally I'm somewhat shocked we've gone this many years with reasonably open smartphones. Next step is probably closing bootloaders in new laptops, as part of the switch to ARM (which is already undergoing).
I'm pretty seriously considering the pinephone. I think it's super neat there's a LoRa module backplate you can buy with it, although my understanding is nobody has made it work with meshtastic yet.
I'm a huge fan of Pine64, but I wouldn't expect the PinePhone to be a great replacement for an Android smartphone. Personally I have quite extensive experience with PineBook Pro, PineTime and PineBuds Pro. I haven't had the chance to try the PinePhone, but I'd definitely go for the Pro.
Even then, prepare for a junky experience and forget about lixuries such as good camera, nice screen, smooth UI/UX. Their devices are great, and the ideas behind them more so. But unfortunately they rarely work well, perhaps with the exception of PineBuds Pro.
Plain burner flip phone and a wifi only Linux device that connects to a hotspot. F google and Apple.
@Sailor88@lemmy.world @ComradePedro@lemmy.ml
I'd really love a Linux phone (personally, I have a Linux PC and I use Arch, btw) so don't get me wrong when I question: what about the banking and government apps? Yeah, because finance systems are getting increasingly digital around the world and every payment will eventually need to involve banking apps, and you guessed it: just Android (Google) and iOS (Apple), no Linux, no KaiOS. One will eventually need apps to pay for rent and consumer bills, even for buying groceries, as fiat currency will get more digital and less physical.
And, no, European Union won't fight against it because, in fact, the same European Union is seeking to digitalize EUR (see "ECB publishes third progress report on the digital euro preparation phase", published by European Central Bank on 16 July 2025). It's not a matter of if, but when physical currencies will become ruled out, and "For Our Security™", Linux (alonside other alternative OSes) will either be ruled out from internet banking altogether or it'll be forced to comply with "security requirements" that, in practice, would turn Linux indistinguishable from Android and iOS.
And this seems to be where everywhere is headed, it's not just an European or USian phenomenon. The future is bleak.
what about the banking and government apps?
Use the browser versions. Not everything has to be done through apps
@mnemonicmonkeys@sh.itjust.works
I'm Brazilian and many Brazilian banks require apps, be it for generating a unique code (e.g. Itaú's iToken) to authorize/authenticate, to scan a QR code every time the Web client requests an action (e.g. Mercado Pago and Santander), or even to do mobile-only transactions such as Pix (Brazilian instant payment/transfer) because our Central Bank (BACEN, who created and maintains Pix nationwide) requires banks to limit Pix in a per-device basis. The latter is crucial because Pix became the main payment method around here, and it can't be done through Web browsers.
Then, there are the "safety measures" inherent to these banking apps, so they refuse to work outside rawdogged Android/iOS. Even enabling "Developer mode" or having some apps installed (such as Termux; apps can see which other apps you have installed) is enough for some banks to refuse logging in (and certain banking apps won't even tell why, just some generic error message).
Also, depending on where a person works, the employer may require the employee to receive their paycheck at a specific bank, which in turn will require an app if the employee is willing to use their own paycheck to pay their bills. Banks have been trying to push their mobile internet banking to their customers, with many banks (such as Bradesco) closing many of their physical branches so people have no nearby ATMs to do banking things.
Finally, even browser-based internet banking (e.g. Caixa Econômica Federal) sometimes require the installation of software akin to kernel-level anti-cheat because "muh security", and some will support neither Linux nor virtualized Windows (most (if not all) virtualization hypervisors can be easily detected by techniques such as the Red-Pill).
So it's not as easy as "use the browser versions", unfortunately.
That sounds horrifying. Although also completely predictable and expected, but I didn't know that in Brazil it had reached that level. Isn't Lula supposed to do something about it? Back in his first presidency (I was in Brazil back then), Linux was becoming the main OS.
Although the usual 2 party system ensures that the next government would destroy everything, so I imagine all the open source effort was demolished and it can't keep being rebuilt from scratch every 4 years, when the next government return everything to microsoft.
Anyway, I sent you a message because I have personal interest in the issue. Thanks for the useful but horrifying information.
well need a wine for android. or just a vm.
You will use Monero or Parrish.
No, seriously though, the circular economy is growing and by contributing to it, you are giving the middle finger to these fuckers.
Monero will be illegal to own within the EU next year.
It won't be illegal to own it. It just won't be possible to buy it from a centralized exchange.
How do we know its not a scam like the rest?
Because the government outright hates it and is doing everything it can short of outright banning it which would be a transparent violation of their own laws. When the government hates it so much that they literally write papers on purposely attacking it in order to suppress it, you know there's something there.
Until substantially more people join the fight for privacy or something else fundamentally changes, I think there is a very real possibility of Google completely clamping down on Android while governments and workplaces mandate apps that only run on phones with all of Google or Apple's bells and whistles.
But the folks at GrapheneOS, Calyx, and Murena seem to be a devoted and resourceful bunch, so I am hopeful that they can give something for us to work with, even if Google pulls the plug, whether it's a fork of Android or rebasing to mobile Linux.
If that all falls through, I'll look for whichever phone supports Linux best and eventually move everything over. The vast majority of the apps I use regularly on my GrapheneOS phone aren't very demanding and have a decent alternative on Linux. And whatever apps are forced on me by other people will reside on a dedicated Android phone, ideally with a removable battery.
For this year, I'd still recommend a secondhand or reseller Pixel with GrapheneOS. Everything just works on it.
Things are fine for now, but long term Google will force out FOSS third parties. Linux phones get better every day, though. I imagine Linux will be relatively ready for primetime by the time Graphene can no longer continue.
Things are fine for now
famous call to inaction that brought us to the shitty situation we face today
I have seen no examples of a Linux os that is even close to being usable for daily smartphone needs and progress is laughable in most cases. What are you seeing that makes you think it's an option for anyone but the most stubborn of users?
sorry to say, but this is 100% true. i've tried postmarketos, manjaro and ubuntu touch – light years behind android and ios.
I'm not saying it is currently ready, I've never used a Linux phone. I'm just saying it will probably be fine in a decade or whenever Google manages to choke out Graphene and such on the Android side.
GrapheneOS still intends to support all the supported devices until EOL. The sideloading change doesn’t affect them. It won’t apply to GrapheneOS. It only applies to certified OSes and GrapheneOS is not certified because it doesn’t license Google Mobile Services. As per the rip out of the device trees for Pixels, that just makes Pixels like other phones. GrapheneOS has been able to expand it’s automation to build that device support themselves. For new devices, making the support will take longer than it did in the past though, but they will still support those Pixels, as long as they meet the hardware requirements and still allow third-party OS support with all security features intact. Besides that GrapheneOS is actively talking with a major Android OEM right now in order to help them reach the security requirements for a subset of their future devices. They are very optimistic about that.
Android is Linux of course since the Android kernel is a Linux kernel. I’m aware you are probablly referring to using traditional Linux OSes that are typically used on desktops on mobile phones. That would, however, be a significant regression for security. Android and iOS are both modern mobile OSes with an in-depth security model which includes a mandatory app sandbox with a sane permission model. This is not present on traditional desktop OSes. This is not meant to diss on those OSes, they are just children of their time, they were created much earlier, security practices have evolved. I can see why it would be a fun experience though to tinker with, it would just not be a secure experience and it’s unlikely to get there because the improvements in traditional Linux distros go much slower than they go on Android and Android is already massively ahead.
At this point, I'm just hoping to grab a HarmonyOS phone soon. I'd rather have China hoovering up my data than the US, 5 &14-Eyes, and fascist US tech corporation. Terrible compromise, but I don't see an inexpensive Linux phone on the horizon any time soon.
What do you think will happen next?
Development of Linux on mobile will ramp up.
EU or similar wrecking Google over being monopolistic would be nice but unlikely.
Same but targeting phone manufacturers.
We need the EU to regulate Banking and Payment apps to not rely on Google apis first and mandate that they have to be available in open app stores or as apk.
Right now the EU regulation is pushing banks to require more of Google or Apple because it's unclear and banks won't take a chance of getting fined.
Among the requirements are: ensure the device and the OS were not "altered". What does that mean exactly? Answer: [crickets].
But that's why many banks just go with the Google Play Integrity API.