this post was submitted on 08 Oct 2025
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Ukraine

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Trolls & bots fail to understand or accept that Russia is anything but infinite and inevitable - but numbers are numbers. They've spent half of their entire Soviet inheritance to steal what they sit on today. The war doesn't end when they get to zero vehicles. The half they've squandered is surely the BETTER half, and they still need an army for territorial defense and internal repression. Ukraine is not about the break, and this is probably the best position Russia is ever going to be in. This is the endgame of this messy, abusive Divorce, and Pootz has to come up with some whopper lies to say it was all worthwhile.

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[–] NigelFrobisher@aussie.zone 24 points 2 days ago (3 children)

What if they visit the middle aisle of Aldi though?

[–] Skua@kbin.earth 11 points 2 days ago

Don't worry, we've left some diving fins and an electric scooter as decoys while we relocate most of the strategically useful inventory to Lidl

[–] Bronzebeard@lemmy.zip 2 points 1 day ago

They might find some of Aldi's nuts.

[–] zod000@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 2 days ago

With the immense power contained within the kid's activity books, seasonal candle holder, and random baking sheets they find, Russia will be unstoppable!

[–] ChicoSuave@lemmy.world 49 points 2 days ago (2 children)

Russia will likely have more time than we expect. North Korea are proving to be more helpful than expected and have tons of old Soviet era hardware that they would be willing to sell in exchange for some more rocket tech or nuke stuff.

China would also likely be selling their old Soviet era hardware they might still have kicking around. A lot of countries around the world see Putin as desperate and rich so they will be happy to make some money selling older hardware back to the country that made it. Putin likely sees this as fine since the hardware works with the existing forces.

But the money and favors aren't infinite. Putin is still dying of old age and disease. It's a long road but Ukraine is destined to succeed.

[–] Tuuktuuk@piefed.ee 40 points 2 days ago

The Russia won't run out of military equipment anytime soon. The most important reason to destroy it is that it's expensive to replace. And when it comes to air defence radars, also not really all that possible to replace.

What brings the war to end is economy. The Russia's economy won't survive very long anymore, and once the state is bankrupt, it no longer can pay the high salaries to its soldiers. Since the soldiers are in it almost exclusively for the money, that will mean there will no longer be new soldiers to replace the losses.

The Russia can of course print more money, but that will cause inflation, meaning that the soldiers' salaries need to be raised more, which increases the need to print more money, which... :)

[–] partial_accumen@lemmy.world 24 points 2 days ago (2 children)

North Korea are proving to be more helpful than expected and have tons of old Soviet era hardware that they would be willing to sell in exchange for some more rocket tech or nuke stuff.

According to Wikipedia the Soviet era tanks NK has is a few thousand T-55s and some T-62Ms. The T-62 varients are likely good enough to use on the battlefield, but the T-55s may not even be worth the fuel it takes to transport them. Remember Russia was fielding some T-55s not by using them as tanks, but by filling them with explosives and sending them uncrewed against Ukainian lines as bombs-with-tracks.

NK also has a bunch of 60 and 70s era Chinese tanks, but China may object to actual Chinese military hardware fighting in Ukraine.

source

[–] Skua@kbin.earth 15 points 2 days ago

Russia have lost hundreds of T-62s in this war already but barely any T-54/55s, so it seems that Russia agrees that fielding the older ones isn't worthwhile. Or 55s are magically invincible, of course, but I know which version I think is more likely

[–] supersquirrel@sopuli.xyz 2 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

Every single one of the tanks you just mentioned are so painfully obsolete when fighting against Ukraine which has good reconnaisance and artillery that it is actually probably hurting Russian soldiers chance of survival to see these tanks in action and believe they bring any kind of safety or strength to them.

Of course NK and China can keep providing equipment, I think in some sense neither nation will let Russia catastrophically lose it will just be that more and more of Russia will be sold off wholesale to the elite in NK and China in one way or another in exchange for them doing whatever is necessary to ensure Russia doesn't entirely collapse militarily in the middle of an offensive.

This kind of support is not anywhere near as useful as domestic capability though, just ask Ukraine about that... There are limitations, stipulations, logistical nightmares full of foreign equipment headaches, and at the end of the day the equipment China and especially NK are able to provide just isn't that comparatively effective and it especially isn't any more survivable than the trash armor that Russia uses so....

Yeah, Russia can continue this war for a long time, that is not in question, but the idea that Russia has this major stock of tanks they can wave a magic wand at to make suddenly relevant on the modern battlefield is a ridiculous one that just isn't supported by battlefield evidence or basic logic. They have a limited number of newer production tanks they have kept back from the frontlines because they stopped using them knowing how futile it was so shrugs.

Russia can take some of the obsolete older tanks and upgrade the turret, make it remote control, or sure they can load them up with explosives to use as a kamikaze tank but none of these uses of the tanks is actually an efficient use of them. The only consistent use these tanks would really have are as combat engineering rear backline bunker busters kept well away from intense frontlines and used to uproot machine gun nests that have been isolated and surrounded. However Russia can not even protect its anti-air, artillery or armor, there is no way it can protect obsolete siege equipment so yeah...

Russia ain't doing well, and I think Chinese and North Korean officials are probably pretty pissed that as much as they try to help Russia, Russia just simply degraded its military too far and threw away the lives of too many of its soliders carelessly to be recoverable to the degree it needs to be to even remotely have a chance of winning the Ukraine War. All China, North Korea and other foreign partners can do at this point is try to fill out whatever Russia is doing to make it look more intimidating in the hopes that it disguises the broken back of the Russian military.

[–] bluGill@fedia.io 44 points 2 days ago (2 children)

They seem to have run out of tanks about a year ago. They of course have thousands left, but they now have to consider the risk that a tank might be destroyed today and thus not usable tomorrow. They still use tanks, and lose a few, but they no longer take risks with tanks without considering the costs and so they don't use nearly as many as they used to because they want to preserve those they have left.

We generally expect the same is happened to artillery about now, though we don't know exactly when. They get to choose how many they will risk.

[–] TwinkleToes@lemmy.ca 33 points 2 days ago

Whether they have run 'out' is moot. They've squandered their BEST, at any rate, and aren't bothering to use what remains, and that's kind of the point. Saying that it's 'half gone' is the same as saying it's ALL gone in the context of trying to conquer ukraine. You have to keep a fleet available for credible border defense, future offensive operations (which are now probably off the books) and internal oppression of your own population. And as you say - both in terms of armor and artillery - even if you have remaining stockpiles, you can't sustain this burn rate, and each piece you move forward is less effective that the one it replaced, both in terms of age, utility and the caliber of who's left operating it.

Capabilties degrade when you piss away your army in a sunk cost fallacy revenge project.

[–] Tuuktuuk@piefed.ee 20 points 2 days ago

I have had the understanding since already around summer 2022, that the Russia is completely all-in. Putin sees it so that the Russian Federation equals Putin. For him the loss of his junta means the death of the Russia. If not putting everything in play means your junta will be toppled (that is, in your eyes: Your country will be destroyed for good), then you will absolutely put everything in use. After all, what use is it that you've saved some tanks in storage if your country gets destroyed for good?

They might hold on to a part of their tanks for a couple of months or so, but quite soon they will be on the front as well.

[–] magnetosphere@fedia.io 26 points 2 days ago (1 children)

I wonder… what has become of those who first gave Pootin the β€œtwo weeks” figure?

[–] TwinkleToes@lemmy.ca 23 points 2 days ago

Honestly - I think that's probably what anyone would say to a Mad King. They honestly probably thought that life is too good to screw it up - that he wouldn't actually invade and ruin the whole damn party. The intelligence services and siloviki (baron merchant oligarchs) were all fat, rich and controlled a huge, fairly rich country life a mafia. Why screw it all up? For the vanity of a wicked old perverted gangster ghoul.

[–] Montreal_Metro@lemmy.ca 15 points 2 days ago (1 children)
[–] baldingpudenda@lemmy.world 14 points 2 days ago (1 children)

China if you are listening...

[–] MrMakabar@slrpnk.net 15 points 2 days ago (1 children)

I would honestly not be surprised. Invading a collapsing Russia might well be easier, then invading Taiwan and China has claims of the Russian Far East.

[–] whoisearth@lemmy.ca 14 points 2 days ago (2 children)

Why invade in this day and age when they are already taking through economic vassalage? China isn't dumb. They're playing the long game.

[–] TwinkleToes@lemmy.ca 1 points 1 day ago* (last edited 1 day ago)

Exactly. Xi must be absolutely laughing himself to sleep every day. He has solved all of China's oil, mineral, grain and fresh water supply problems for the next half century. They have unquestioned top dog influence over the Central Asian republics now, a weaker rival for bribable global anti-western allies, and can demand anything from Russia that can't be refused going forward. Including access to the North Pacific, which China has never, ever had.

All without expending a single soldier or loss of a single piece of hardware.

[–] MrMakabar@slrpnk.net 4 points 2 days ago

There are currently billions of frozen assets in the West and also oil and gas pipelines to Europe. With a peace deal, it would be possible to restart the sale of oil and gas and maybe even get the money. Even if they have to give it to Ukraine, that would be less of a problem, as they do not control it anyway. Especially if Putin gets couped, this might well leave Russia as part of the EU sphere of influence, which would give them the option to move soldiers 1000km from Bejing.

[–] favoredponcho@lemmy.zip 19 points 2 days ago (3 children)

Someone should invade Russia. I’m sure it would be easy to take a slice of territory if you wanted it.

[–] TwinkleToes@lemmy.ca 33 points 2 days ago (1 children)

If this were a board game, now is precisely the time that China would push into Siberia all the way to the Western edge of the Urals, and there's not much Russia could do about it short of nukes.

[–] JillyB@beehaw.org 14 points 2 days ago (25 children)

short of nukes

That is a very big thing Russia could do about it.

[–] TwinkleToes@lemmy.ca 6 points 2 days ago

Which would assure their complete and total destruction. Of course nukes are a big thing. They're the LAST thing.

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[–] BedSharkPal@lemmy.ca 20 points 2 days ago (1 children)

China must be loving this...

[–] TwinkleToes@lemmy.ca 38 points 2 days ago

No doubt. Wihout expending a single soldier's life or piece of equipment, they got promoted to undisputed master of the axis of authoritarian nightmare shitholes, can demand ANYTHING from russia going forward and won't be refused. They solved all their water, resource and mineral needs for a century or more, have gained strategic access to the North Pacific, which China has n-e-v-e-r ever had in history. Russia has become the junior vassal resource yard for China's next century of growth. Now they have to solve their demographic problems, or it won't matter much.

Putin will end up being the worst russian in history, which is REALLY an accomplishment. The man who gave the country away to China, pissed away the entire inheritance of the USSR, destroyed their primary export markets for a vanity revenge project.

[–] tal@olio.cafe 19 points 3 days ago (1 children)

and Pootz has to come up with some whopper lies to say it was all worthwhile.

I think that it largely is oriented around the whole of NATO being trying to attack Russia and Russia trying to defend itself.

[–] TwinkleToes@lemmy.ca 21 points 3 days ago* (last edited 3 days ago) (4 children)

Could be. The recent, obvious strategy of flying drones and jets blatantly into NATO airspace has some purpose behind it. It seems foolhardy to invite NATO to attack Russia, but in that case, you'd probably see a much more explicit level of support from China, including direct military support/aid or even Chinese military intervention. On balance, I think the probing nature of those recent incidents is just to test the political response of NATO, see if they're really willing to take action over transgressions in Poland, Romania & the Baltics.

[–] tal@olio.cafe 18 points 3 days ago* (last edited 2 days ago) (2 children)

I don't read much Russian media, but from what I've seen of Russian political cartoons and translated TV over the war, the "NATO is attacking us" thing is a theme.

Some of it related to where Russia had made a blunder and had a poor military outcome. My guess is that it's maybe politically acceptable in Russia to lose a battle against NATO or something, but not against Ukraine, that the latter is a humilliation or something like that. After Ukraine did its Kursk offensive into Russia, I saw a bunch of material like that. Material all about how it must have been the US or UK who planned it. shrugs I was thinking "I'd be more worried about the actual offensive", but TV was more worried about establishing that Ukraine couldn't manage something like this.

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