They really need to stop calling it a tip. It's a bid for service.
Drivers shouldn't be allowed to see the tip amount prior to delivery completion. That, or tipping shouldn't be allowed until after completion. I hate this more recent model of tipping before receiving service. Because as you said, it's a bid for service, not an acknowledgement of good service.
Flip it around - why would you work a job, any job, where you don't know your pay until after the work is done?
"Tipping" is rich-people speak for shifting the expense (and blame) to the customer.
They already know the pay. If the pay isn't enough without the tip, then maybe they should consider getting a different job.
You realize that gig economy is the neoliberal slang for a poverty class work, but without the rights of workers, right?
So you're criticizing people who are forced by the system in which we live, to be ordered around by a fucking algorithm, and then take abuse from people who have enough money to NOT work in the gig economy, but no where near enough to actually own the servant class they get off on abusing.
You realize that the gig economy is not my responsibility, right? I'm not criticizing the workers for being underpaid. I'm criticizing the exploiters for underpaying their workers. If you can't pay your workers enough, that is not my fault. You are not entitled to exploit anyone for your personal gain.
Tips are no longer tips and companies have successfully forced us to pay their employees for them.
It's not the customer's fault. In addition to us paying their wages we have to trust some rando to do a good job with zero evidence they will.
There's nothing to flip, gratuity and wages should be separate things. And minimum, standard living wages should be paid.
Stop using DoorDash and other delivery services. They're a huge scam and you end up paying double for cold food that someone might have tampered with.
This. They are predatory to their drivers, their customers, and the restaurants they almost blackmail into using them. Awful awful company.
It does, but the thinking here is that the dasher basically loses money taking no tip orders. Which in my Nordic mind is a fucked up business model. A living wage should be the minimum requirement.
Look at the socialist over here guys, over here in America we let our children go without lunch if they can't afford it. How else will they learn that they need to be a productive member of society?
Frankly, I wouldn't want to live under some authoritarian healthcare system that no longer allowed me the freedom to weigh my options between crippling debt and death... Variety is the spice of life!
It’s worse. They aren’t employees. They are independent contractors who in many cases assume all liability and have to pay their own payroll taxes. Most aren’t reporting it to their insurance company, much less thinking about retirement and healthcare. It only really works as a temporary side gig.
This entire tipping thing is terrible - including for dashers themselves.
It means dashers income heavily relies on strangers being kind enough to leave some extra.
It means customers are gonna feel bad for not paying more than their order amount (and they probably will pay the tip)
It means company can employ slave labor for extremely low pay and still have people willing to do this.
Tipping benefits only one party - the companies. We need to stop it.
Stop fucking using these extortion apps. Drive your lazy ass to the shit food station yourself.
I stopped ordering from these apps because I got tired of watching the driver take my food on a tour of my city and having it arrive cold and wrong.
The last time I went to pick up my food from a restaurant I saw a dasher standing outside a restaurant staring at his phone with food in his hand, I went inside and while I was waiting the dude came back in, dropped the food and asked for another order because the one he took wasn't tipping.
Fuck this system and fuck these apps, pick up your own food (if you can).
I stopped using them when I stopped being given free delivery because without the discount, a thing that costs about six bucks suddenly balloons to thirty fucking dollars. On top of it taking longer and my food arriving cold.
I had a local burger joint call me up to tell me that the our food was currently, and had been with the driver for the past 30 mins. They knew this because the guy decided to have dinner in the parking lot after picking up our order so I really try to avoid now
We should really not be normalizing calling money paid in advance to not have your food arrive late/cold a "tip". It's extortion.
Tipping culture in America is fucked beyond belief. Pay everybody a fair wage and let's get rid of tipping so nobody ever has to deal with this bullshit again.
What I do:
$0 tip
In the special instructions: "Ring doorbell for cash tip. Do not just leave at door".
Traffic in my area is awful so I always tip $20 no matter the order. Sometimes that comes to almost an 80% tip but a) I know it goes to the driver, b) I don't have to drive in that shitshow, and c) I reward a driver for actually reading the special instructions.
Is it even convenient at that point? I don't know if I'd have an extra twenty I can keep tossing out there every time I'm trying to grab a bite.
I used DoorDash today and the add tip screen said that 100% of the tip goes to the driver. I know they got a lot of bad PR for stealing part of the tips some time ago and had to make public statements about improving their policies. Are we saying that even after all that, they’re just outright completely lying?
Before they also said the driver got 100% but behind the scenes they were essentially subtracting that amount from what they were going to pay the driver originally. Thus they could claim the driver got 100% of the tip while still pocketing the value of it.
They get 100% of the tip, it's a legal requirement. The scummy part is the company does this to give you the opportunity NOT to tip, and therefore subsidize the food for shitty people.
Just in case, the few times I have ordered food, I put a dollar or two tip in the app, and add a note saying I'll give them a cash tip. Usually I'll give them a 2-4 Dollars more depending. If you're using these services you need to tip, that's how they make their livelyhood and feed their families.
It's a scummy business, and you should definitely try to avoid using it unless it's your only option for some reason. Your order will probably be at least $30, but do you know how much spaghetti you can make with $30??
Solution is stop using delivery services.
All the bullshit with tipping on food delivery apps made me stop using them years ago.
First I hear the apps are stealing tips. Then they're not stealing tips anymore. Then maybe they're stealing some of the tips.
To try and avoid all that I tried to use cash. The drivers don't get their base rate reduced and they get the entire, non-reportable cash tip. Then my food started taking twice as long and arriving cold because the drivers thought I was stiffing them.
My theory is the apps do this (pre-tipping) on purpose to discourage cash and after-tipping so they can lower what they pay the driver and they'll still accept the order because they see the higher after tip amount. So now the apps might not be technically stealing tips, but they're using up front tips to allow them to reduce their shitty base rate for everyone.
Now if want delivery it's pizza, Chinese, or one of the few other places with their own drivers. I've had this policy for years now and I don't see myself ever going back unless it's an emergency.
Bonus to me: all my takeout/delivery is now 20-30% cheaper. Everyone should really take a look at the inflated prices they're paying and decide if it's really worth saving a short drive.
Fuck tips
You mean "fuck places where I've been socially obligated to pay someone's wage instead of their employer"
For tipping countries like the US, the driver would only get a "has a tip" notification on the order (if they get any information like that at all!) so they can decide. There is no way the driver can see that there is a $40 order with a $4 tip, or a $40 order with a $16 dollar tip. Orders would be ignored all the time, and the service would fail.
Oh, and if they did get a "has tip" flag for the order, then customers could just game it, by selecting "add tip" and setting it to $0 or $0.10 or something so their order gets that "has tip" flag!!
Here is AU, there is no tipping, so the drivers get paid like normal people. None of this work for tip bullshit that seems to have survived this long in the US, its incredible that it has gotten this far. Now the US get asked for tips using self-service machines, that is the height of lunacy!
People on all these astro-turfed anti-tipping posts always have the same AI generated talking points. Rarely ever do these people actually talk about STOPPING using the apps and STOPPING going to restaurants. Stop making "tip culture" the fault of the worker. It is 100% on the business owner for not paying their staff appropriately for the work performed. Not tipping rewards the business and punishes the worker.
Reason I don't use these services is the tip is expected in advance. Bring me my food hot and in a timely fashion and I'll give you a good tip. I'm not paying you ahead of time to take too long bringing me cold food. I'd rather pick it up myself.
Orders with no tip might take longer to get delivered — are you sure?
Well, I 'might' not order from you again then — are you sure?
That's just the opposite of how tipping is supposed to work. If I'm happy with the service, I'll tip (and I'm far, far from the US - in a place where you don't get frowned upon if you don't tip) - and by "happy" I don't even mean something extraordinary - but I can't know if I will be happy in advance. Moreover I'd prefer tipping in cash as opposed to through an app - this way I know the money can go directly in the worker's pocket, not in the company's.
The tip absolutely goes to the dasher. The screwed up system aside you are only compounding the exploitation of the delivery driver.
Don't use the app but don't get mad at a system that you're choosing to participate in and actively making worse.
Add a note in delivery instructions “cash tip”.
It also gives the advantage of tipping less if it takes too long ;)
Home to all things "Mildly Infuriating" Not infuriating, not enraging. Mildly Infuriating. All posts should reflect that.
I want my day mildly ruined, not completely ruined. Please remember to refrain from reposting old content. If you post a post from reddit it is good practice to include a link and credit the OP. I'm not about stealing content!
It's just good to get something in this website for casual viewing whilst refreshing original content is added overtime.
Rules:
1. Be Respectful
Refrain from using harmful language pertaining to a protected characteristic: e.g. race, gender, sexuality, disability or religion.
Refrain from being argumentative when responding or commenting to posts/replies. Personal attacks are not welcome here.
...
2. No Illegal Content
Content that violates the law. Any post/comment found to be in breach of common law will be removed and given to the authorities if required.
That means: -No promoting violence/threats against any individuals
-No CSA content or Revenge Porn
-No sharing private/personal information (Doxxing)
...
3. No Spam
Posting the same post, no matter the intent is against the rules.
-If you have posted content, please refrain from re-posting said content within this community.
-Do not spam posts with intent to harass, annoy, bully, advertise, scam or harm this community.
-No posting Scams/Advertisements/Phishing Links/IP Grabbers
-No Bots, Bots will be banned from the community.
...
4. No Porn/Explicit
Content
-Do not post explicit content. Lemmy.World is not the instance for NSFW content.
-Do not post Gore or Shock Content.
...
5. No Enciting Harassment,
Brigading, Doxxing or Witch Hunts
-Do not Brigade other Communities
-No calls to action against other communities/users within Lemmy or outside of Lemmy.
-No Witch Hunts against users/communities.
-No content that harasses members within or outside of the community.
...
6. NSFW should be behind NSFW tags.
-Content that is NSFW should be behind NSFW tags.
-Content that might be distressing should be kept behind NSFW tags.
...
7. Content should match the theme of this community.
-Content should be Mildly infuriating.
-At this time we permit content that is infuriating until an infuriating community is made available.
...
8. Reposting of Reddit content is permitted, try to credit the OC.
-Please consider crediting the OC when reposting content. A name of the user or a link to the original post is sufficient.
...
...
Also check out:
Partnered Communities:
Reach out to LillianVS for inclusion on the sidebar.
All communities included on the sidebar are to be made in compliance with the instance rules.
