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Hollywood can’t ditch its Teslas fast enough: “They’re destroying their leases and walking away”
(www.hollywoodreporter.com)
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this post was submitted on 22 Sep 2024
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What is the problem with glued panels?
Well for one glue breaks down at borderline random amounts, could last one year could last a hundred also imagone if one came off going 70 on the 15.
Adhesives are used in many aerospace applications to bond panels and structural elements. Some Lotus racing and street cars chassis are bonded aluminum! Lotus are racing chassis specialists, making chassis for other racing teams.
The space shuttle's bottom tile heat shield, which withstood insane temperatures and stresses, were glued.
Adhesive science is pretty cool. You may want to read up a bit.
Take a look here. I've used their adhesives and 3M, also an impressive range, in a signmaking business I used to own. Not a single sign has failed in decades, weathering rain, snow, wind, very hot summers. We are talking pretty big surfaces, under pretty big loads and stresses.
Is that the glue that Tesla is using thought? Are they applying it correctly?
I find your post very cool but I still have skepticism about the application of adhesives here, specifically because they seem to be used on this truck in many places where they don’t need to be. Why use an adhesive over a fastener? In my mind, you generally wouldn’t.
Also I think signage is a decent comparison to an automotive application but it isn’t a perfect one. You’re basically comparing a mostly static load scenario to a completely dynamic one. It’d be more akin to the aerospace example but even those adhesives are in a very different use case. These cybertruck adhesives have to last 7+ years of thermal cycling and dynamic loading. If these adhesives hold up over time, I’ll be very impressed.
There are many reasons to use adhesives rather than fasteners. A very basic one is that fasteners weaken the surface where the drill is made, and all the forces are borne by the fastening point. With adhesives, forces are borne by the entire piece. How's that for a neat trick?
Another advantage is that you don't see a rivet or screw head on your nice shiny surface.
I never said signage was a 1:1 comparison with automotive, just that I've installed a lot of signs, some very large, whose structure was made of bonded aluminum, that many are over a decade old, that some withstand major stresses, and that none have failed.
As to the longevity? Do you often hear about planes losing panels? Because there are a heck of a lot of bonded panels in airplanes, both commercial and military.
Also, probably somewhere in your cars there are some bonded surfaces.
Lastly, Lotus has been making their sport scar chassis mostly bonded aluminum for the past, what, 30 years, maybe more? There is not a single case of delamination in those years. Good enough for me.
Well color me convinced, that’s all pretty good info that I had no clue about. Forgive my skepticism, I’ve just never run into adhesive applications like that. Seems like they’ve come a long way, but due to economic pressures I’m guessing that myself and others have only ever had experiences with adhesives that are sub par. Even here I’m still curious about the properties of what Tesla is using. Especially since I’ve seen those panels be removed without heating or damage and just by pulling them off. Then again, ultimate strength of these adhesives doesn’t need to be insanely high, they just need to be durable probably. Thanks for the insight!
Edit: I went to go look this up and they are indeed using a 3M product along with a BETAMATE DuPont product, all of which seem up to snuff and are industry standard. I think now I know the adhesives are the least of the concerns with the truck, which is interesting.
Im vague aware though my interests lay with metallurgy and old pieces of tech, these two kinda feed into eachother. Anyways my point shouldve reflected moreso on the fact that Tesla has shit build quality that makes the Ford Pinto look like an M1 Abrams in comparison, do you really think they are using decwnt quality adhesive for their vehicles?
I think the engineering is probably mostly sound. I don't trust the execution. Many adhesives need specific curing times, temperatures, UV lights, whatever. If you don't respect those...
That's my concern. Application/execution, not design. Let's remember that Musk believes in advancing by BOOOM
The cybertruck has a fucking aluminum frame, its tow hitch is attached to fucken aluminum. The engineering on the cybertruck is a crapshoot from that alone.