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this post was submitted on 06 Dec 2023
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if the US actually re elect him they're fucked
Yup, and Trump doesn't have a choice. It's looking more and more likely that he's going to lose a lot of money and potentially face jail time. His only way out is to seize power. Since he's backed himself into a corner, he'll try everything to steal the next election, including another coup attempt.
I don't personally think it'll work, but on the slim chance it does many of us will be facing an existential threat which will require swift action. He's already publicly stated that he sees leftists as vermin which need to be eradicated, and I, for one, don't want to give him the chance to act on that threat.
Yeah and Donnie’s definition of leftist is anyone that isn’t actively deep throating his boot
Of course he has a choice.
He can choose facing the consequences of his actions.
If that's unappealing, he can also choose to, let's say, "pull an Epstein".
Let's not give him the benefit of saying this is the only "strategy" he has left, because that implies you can't blame him for trying. Like any reasonable person in his position would do the same thing.
And that's complete nonsense. He's not an animal stuck in a bear trap, he's a human being, who has been very open about his penchant for fascism long before he was charged.
If you are making a joke here, it is funny.
Epstein did not kill himself.
Regardless it's an option for him.
Nobody said otherwise.
If somehow, Trump managed to off himself despite constant monitoring by his secret service detail, what a shame that'd be.
I might have to take a day off of work just to celebrate.
I'm speaking pragmatically. Perhaps 'choice' wasn't the best word.
I find both of these alternatives extremely unlikely, but here's hoping.
He's too much of a narcissist to pull an Epstein
The leftists need to learn how to use guns and own them. SocialistRA and liberalgunowners are communities that welcome leftist gun enthusiasts and new comers who want to learn for whatever reason.
There are plenty of "leftists" who own guns in the US.
They just don't flaunt it around like the rightards do.
As evident by the 2 orgs I Listed in my comment. I'm aware, but most of the left aren't gun owners, like 70%. I'm obviously not talking about the ones who already are.
Issue is, the whole world will be effected by it.
Hard to say what would have happened, but I feel like I was pretty much unaffected as an European the last time.
It is difficult to say because you do not observe the counterfactual. I would definitely say we would have progressed more on climate action if HRC had become president. Also, the culture war issues would have definitely played out differently. The Trump presidency also emboldened Putin, which may have affected the situation in Ukraine. But again, in foreign policy so many things happen simultaneously that it’s often difficult to pinpoint direct causes.
In Canada, we've seen a rise in Trump-like politics...
I live in europe currently, and there's been a hard right turn here since trump seriously got on the scene. In france Macron only beat the female french trump by a small margin. In Italy, they've elected a hard right person as their leader, In switzerland, the right wing party is in power. Trump was the first domino to fall and now we're going to be seeing shit like that all over.
but yeah, I was pretty much not directly affected by any of that shit that happened stateside.
If that is the objective truth, then count yourself lucky for being a white, ethno-european, climate denier.
Yeah, probably wasn't great for climate action, but that's true for all conservative politicians not just the crazy ones. How did Trump affect whites and non-whites living in Europe differently?
Stuff and reasons, basically. But actually the worst thing he could do is try to leave or undermine NATO, and ditch Ukraine
We're all fucked, not just the states
This is the “best” America can push forward, we are already fucked. We were fucked 24 years ago.
The right wing in America has been sliding further right for a long time, and tending to drag the left along with it. (Nobody is under the impression that the US "left" isn't actually center-right.) In the last decade, that rightward silde has accelerated. Trump, being the presumptive Republican nominee for president, is the "best" that the lunatic far right - not America - can push forward.
The Democratic party, representing the ~~left~~ center-right, is no longer allowing itself to be dragged further right. And there remains a fairly large proportion of people who still call themselves Republicans who oppose the burgeoning fascism. Those are the people who feel politically homeless right now; they just need someplace to go and someone to vote for. Liz Cheney is floating a third party run, and I think she's easily able to consolidate "sane conservative" support.
I was predicting that the Republican party would split back in 2015. I had no idea they would drag on like this for so long.
See: Overton Window
Exactly: that's when the first coup (the Brooks Brothers Riot) succeeded.
As an American I think we're fucked already.
Were fucked, We just get a 50% chance to choose what hole.
https://youtu.be/y2GwrR-4Q9E?si=Uq84Q60guxoeUpsG
Let's not demonize Trump man, he really brought what a lot of people thought would be a culture war into an economic war, which you may think is bad, but it's actually brought a more muted epiphany for many across both sides that for many people jobs are very important to their lives, unlike in EU where places like Scandinavia, Spain or Greece see culture wars as mud to be stepped on and brushed off but economic sanction is a more realistic declaration of conflict of interest
I don't think the American people would ever let a Dictator get that far. If Trump gets nominated by the GOP you'll see so much violence that by election day the entire course of history in the United States will be forever changed. I personally believe the GOP will not let him be nominated and will reject him. Trump will run third party and split the vote and give the Democrats a huge win.
I wished I could be so optimistic. They have had endless chances to reject him and haven't. It's almost like Putin has some leverage on a bunch of em lol.
He will get nominated, but hopefully my fellow Americans will not let him return to the white house.
Maybe instead he'll just die while shitting on his gold toilet some time next year. Would be kinda nice.
I wish that were true, but I suspect that the American people have become too passive to resist a dictator. He won't take over by force, but cloaked in legitimacy, just like Hitler and Mussolini did. Heck, you don't even have to go back that far. That's Putin's playbook, too. A Republican President also has a Supreme Court that favors very strong presidential powers and a permanently divided and largely impotent Congress. No real resistance there.
So, what's left? The police? American police would love having more power under a dictator. The public hates cops these days, and a dictator would restore their "rightful place" as respected and feared enforcers who will "clean up the streets".
The military? Well, that's a wild card. They may not support a dictator, but they also don't want to start a civil war. I think a US dictator will give himself enough legal cover and legitimacy to convince the military to hang back from interfering in politics.
The most likely source of resistance is from individual states. However, I'm not sure what they can do, realistically. Secession would certainly start a civil war, which would play right into the dictator's hands, giving him the perfect excuse to suspend rights and use the military for domestic purposes.
Just want to mention Tommy Tuberville holding up military appointments. Unrelated I'm sure.
Despite claiming he will stop blocking such appointments, he is still going to continue blocking the appointments of 3 and 4 star generals.
They literally had the chance to stop him during his second impeachment after the attempted insurrection. Anyone who didn't do it then, sure as hell isn't going to do anything now.
The last thing the GOP wants to do is piss off his supporters right before the next presidential election. The electoral college could have ousted him during the 2016 election (as people had floated around) too. There's just not enough people are willing or have the desire to reject him. Many would love to have him as a dictator, they just need the right pieces in the SCOTUS to say it's in the constitution.
He's 100% going to be the nominee now. Even if he goes to jail, he's still going to be the nominee. The time for anything different is LONG past.
Why do you think there will be violence before the election, but after Trump's nomination? In this scenario, in your mind, who are the ones that kick off this violence?
Historical evidence on the rise of Dictators. You have to opress your opposition through violence to look strong. I foresee Kent State style responses from Trump loyalists in law enforcement.
Before the election? Why would they do it before the election? I don't really understand what you're saying.
You think they want a fair election? It will be January 6 on steroids.
Yes, and Jan 6 happened after the election...
They will be fine (as fine as these nutjobs can be) until the results are announced. If Trump loses, then they go crazy. If he wins, they'll be very happy (but also go crazy because these people are insane).
They are not going to risk an election.
If you prosecute violence against your opposition, publicly and with great force, you run a good chance of terrifying large portions of your opposition's voting base into not voting for fear of implied violence.