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this post was submitted on 18 Jun 2024
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Ask Lemmy
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He does sound like a tool.
I'm not sure what I meant either, I'll just remove it. I'm sure I had a brilliant thought behind it at the time!
I have heard of Male Gaze with capital letters, but I was asking more about y'alls experience noticing eyeballs on you rather than how THEY perceive you. Using words that have a more specific defined meaning is probably more evidence for "Pidgin needs to think before writing".
I presume this is the video you meant. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1MTtYyZ1zd8
I never saw Birds of Prey because Suicide Squad was so bad! Maybe it deserves a watch. I do notice the usually unnecessary sexiness in movies.
I wanted to learn more about women's perspective on this. Sometimes my "don't be a dick" plan needs more detail, and being more aware of what kind of behaviour is problematic might steer me better. I've heard the phrase male gaze but I don't think I fully understand what is meant by it, and I feel your question may point to and illuminate a kind of discrimination that I want to avoid.
As a man, here is my understanding, so take it with a grain of salt.
While men staring at women is a problem, it is not what is meant by "male gaze". That term is usually used to describe the way societal norms regarding women were strongly formed by men and what they like. The way conservatives generally expect women to present themselves and behave is heavily influenced by the male gaze. To my understanding, the exact standards differ by culture, but usually its along the lines of being submissive and fitting some beauty standard.
If a person who is read as female (aka "looks like a woman") does not adhere to those standards, they will face ramifications, because our society mostly has men calling the shots. On the flip side, people who are read as female, and try to please the male gaze while also genetically being lucky enough to fit the beauty standards, can benefit from it (see: beauty privilege).
Regarding your plan to not be a dick, I think if you just treat people as people, regardless of their appearance, you are (passively) working against the perpetuation of the male gaze. I think that would also mean you're not discriminating anyone.
Apologies if I misunderstood your comment and you were not asking/looking for an explanation.
That was helpful, thanks. I'm very much looking for insight, explanation and experiences.
If I've grasped what you're saying (and please re-steer me if not), the male gaze is a kind of societal expectation that women would present themselves in certain ways to walk the tightrope of some sort of impossible-to-attain universal male approval, and where women are harassed on the one hand for for not pleasing male eyes and on the other hand, harassed for pleasing male eyes - an obviously lose-lose situation. As such then, this male gaze would exist in the way some men behave towards women and in the head space this takes up in the minds of women who have been repeatedly hit with these expectations.
Yep, that is pretty much how I understand it as well
Thank you for being on the Internet.
Thank you too. It is very refreshing to have such a pleasant interaction on the internet.
If it's helpful, I'm glad! I was just curious and it's fun to hear real people's perspectives.
What a dick. I love your descriptive reply - it’s so, so true.
If I broke down and you came to help me I wouldn’t care if you were wearing a full fursuit.
I’d be thanking you to no end.