I would say Seagate Exos or Western Digital Ultrastar.
Buy recertified enterprise grade disks from https://serverpartdeals.com. Prices were around $160/16TB the last time I checked. Mix brands and models to reduce simultaneous failure. Use more than 1-disk redundancy. If you can't buy from SPD, either find an alternative or buy external drives and shuck them. Use ZFS to know if your data is correct. I've been dealing with funny AMD USB controllers recently and the amount of silent data corruption I'd have gotten if not for ZFS is ridiculous.
Yep, I have 6 14tb drives from them in raid10.
Three-way mirror?
I just keep adding 2 more drives as it gets full. Not sure if that's the best thing.
Check out blackblaze drive stats, https://www.backblaze.com/cloud-storage/resources/hard-drive-test-data
This. They provide outstanding insights and the articles they provide alongside the data are quite good.
Any hard drive can fail at any time with or without warning. Worrying too much about individual drive families' reliability isn't worth it if you're dealing with few drives. Worry instead about backups and recovery plans in case it does happen.
Bigger drives have significantly lower power usage per TB, and cost per TB is lowest around 12-16TB. Bigger drives also lets you fit more storage in a given box. Drives 12TB and up are all currently helium filled which run significantly cooler.
Two preferred options in the data hoarder communities are shucking (external drives are cheaper than internal, so remove the case) and buying refurb or grey market drives from vendors like Server Supply or Water Panther. In both cases, the savings are usually big enough that you can simply buy an extra drive to make up for any loss of warranty.
Under US$15/TB is typically a 'good' price.
For media serving and deep storage, HDDs are still fine and cheap. For general file storage, consider SSDs to improve IOPS.
I use Seagate Ironwolf 4TB drives in mine. Bought them all used, $50-60 each. Check on eBay and Facebook marketplace
After I had two WD drives fail in my old NAS so I switched to all Seagate on my next build. Currently running 9x 20TB Exos X20, though for only about a year now, so no issues should be expected, yet.
I think the most important thing is that you pick a drive that is meant for NAS/server use (so rated for running 24/7). And having manufacturere warrenty is also nice. My Seagate drives have 60 months (which is considerably more then the 36 months that my WD drives had).
my currently failing drive is a WD as well... 🥴 I bought it a year ago, I think...
Switching wholesale from a brand or model to another could be counterproductive. There are myriad of reasons why drives can fail that aren't related to the brand and the model. What if you unknowingly switch to a less reliable model because of such a reason? You'd end up worse off. For example according to Backblaze's data, Seagate is generally worse than WD.
A better way to do this is to mix brands and models so that there's less probability to fail at the same time. I have both WD and Seagate in a single storage pool, even if the Seagate model is objectively less reliable according to Backblaze.
+1 for seagate 🫡
There are two types, CMR and SMR. You can read online about the differences. CMR is better because SMR tries to be all fancy in order to increase capacity, but at the cost of speed and data integrity.
It won't be front and center in the specs of a particular drive, but you usually find the info somewhere.
I wouldn't worry about higher capacity failing sooner. If you have 10x4TB vs 2x20TB, that's 5x as many drives to go bad. So a 20TB drive would need a 5x worse fail rate to be considered worse. A pro of larger (fewer) drives is lower power consumption. 5-10 watts per drive doesn't sound like much, but it adds up.
If you are buying used datacenter drives, larger capacity drives are also likely to be newer, which tips the scales a little more in that direction.
I don't think anyone makes SMR drives in the current lineups anymore.
That's good
I have an external usb hdd , wd passport 3TB from 10 years ago (healthy) connected to a Chinese N100 mini pc. I have proxmox on it, 5 lxc containers, 30 docker containers running apps, plex, calibre web.
I've heard very good things about resold HGST Helium enterprise drives and can be found fairly cheap for what they are on eBay.
I'm looking for something from 4TB upwards. I think I remember that drives with very high capacity are more likely to fail sooner - is that correct?
4TB isn't even close to "very high capacity" these days. There's like 32TB HDDs out there, just avoid the shingled archival drives. I believe the belief about higher capacity drives is a question of maturity of the technology rather than the capacity. 4TB drives made today are much better than the very first 4TB drives we made a long time ago when they were pushing the limits of technology.
Backblaze has pretty good drive reviews as well, with real world failure rate data and all.
I run only used hgst. I have 6 x 3tb drives that are all 90k hour plus and I recently expanded to some new to me 12tb hgst. I always do badblocks test when I get the drive which took 4 days on the 12 tbs. One of them failed and I returned it to Amazon they shipped another and the replacement was perfect. If they package it poorly just return it right away and choose a different distributor.
At home I use two Toshiba MG09ACA18TE's and they work like a charm. I've bought them at around US$20/TB and it was the best price/TB offer at that time.
At work we use Exos X18's and Exos X20's without any problem at all.
I’m looking for something from 4TB upwards.
If you say "harddrive" ... do you mean actual harddrives or are you using it synonymous with "storage"? If you really talk about actual harddrives, it's hard to even find datacenter/server harddrives below 4 TB. Usually server HDDs start with 8 or 12 TB. You can even find HDDs with 20 TB - Seagate Exos series for example, starting at around 360 Euros (ca. 400 USD).
If you're in for a general storage, preferably SSD, that's another issue. There is the Samsung 870 QVO (8 TB) SSD that is often advertised as "datacenter SSD" (so I assume it would run well in a server that is active 24/7), but it is currently available with a maximum of 8 TB. The 870 QVO is at ca. 70 Euros per terabyte (ca. 77 USD) which, in my experience, is the current price range for SSDs. So it has a high price seen from the outside but it's actually fine. It's also a one-time investment.
For selfhosting I'd go with an SSD-only setup.
do any have particularly good or bad reputation?
From personal experience I'd say, stick with the "larger" brands like Samsung or Seagate.
SSD only?
Look at Mr Moneybags over here. That would increase my cost about 400%
And no, I wouldn't recoup that in energy cost reductions, as my oldest NAS with ancient drives only draws a few watts 97% of the time.
Sorry, I can't hear you under my enormous piles of money! 🙃
But yeah. You should do an SSD-only setup if this is within your budget. I assume that for most of us selfhosting is just some soft of hobby. If you're willing to spend money on the latest and cooles tech: do it. If not, then it's fine, too.
I was thinking actual hard drives, not SSDs...
Okay, so ... then maybe really look into the Seagate Exos drives. 20 TB should be pretty much fine for most selfhosting adventures.
I have a few of those, and while the ones I bought have worked out fine so far, I think it's worth cautioning people that they are annoyingly loud doing basic operations.
Absolutely. They’re advertised for being used in datecenters, so I assume noise optimization wasn’t a concern for Seagate when creating those drives.
that wouldn't be a problem for me, as my server is located in the basement. But good to know!
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