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submitted 1 year ago by arcrust@lemmy.ml to c/asklemmy@lemmy.ml

I recently moved to California. Before i moved, people asked me "why are you moving there, its so bad?". Now that I'm here, i understand it less. The state is beautiful. There is so much to do.

I know the cost of living is high, and people think the gun control laws are ridiculous (I actually think they are reasonable, for the most part). There is a guy I work with here that says "the policies are dumb" but can't give me a solid answer on what is so bad about it.

So, what is it that California does (policy-wise) that people hate so much?

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[-] DigitalTraveler42@lemmy.world 168 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

It absolutely has a lot to do with Right wing/Republican propaganda, California, Chicago, and New York represent everything they hate so they constantly use both states and that city as negative talking points.

One point they constantly make is that New York City is a crime riddled hellhole, meanwhile NYC has one of the lowest crime rates in the entire country, and one of the lowest murder rates, it's just a massive city with a massive population and everyone there has cameras so when stuff happens it goes viral. Also the Red States tend to have much higher crime and murder rates.

All in all this is usual conservative/right wing tactics, they constantly want to isolate and segregate themselves from other ideas, and aren't afraid to take over where other people live to exclude the people already living there. This is why Idaho, Texas, Florida, and Utah have similar campaigns about "don't California my state" and by "California" they mean don't bring your "liberal/socialist/Communist/woke/progressive/democratic" outlook to their states, because they don't want to be responsible for cleaning up the racism and various other problems that the red states seem to have adopted as their identities.

Also I know quite a few conservative Californians and New Yorkers that recently moved to Texas and Florida, and as conservative as they thought they were they actually talk about moving back to where they came from because of how it is in their new states, except for the fact that they moved to the new states because they can afford so much more than what they could in California.

Overall my point is, if you consume right wing media then you are conditioned to hate blue states, and particularly those blue states are Cali, NY, and the city of Chicago as well as DC, I'm not saying these places are without flaws, but I am saying that the propaganda and disinformation about those places has amplified the hate towards those places and their residents.

[-] scrubbles@poptalk.scrubbles.tech 63 points 1 year ago

My conservative family still asks if I'm safe here in Seattle because they "hear so much about it on the news". They still think Seattle is just always being with protests and the libbrerl government is just running the city into the ground.

Which Seattle and most cities have problems, all cities have crime, but no more than usually. It's just that people live in cities. Per Capita crime in a big city can and is around the same of a rural area, but people don't think in terms like per Capita.

But fox news loves to spin that to keep rural people afraid, keep them thankful for their backwards laws and ideas. Because what really happens when you move somewhere like Cali? You meet people from different backgrounds and religions and suddenly your views might be challenged a bit

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[-] Trainguyrom@reddthat.com 26 points 1 year ago

This is why Idaho, Texas, Florida, and Utah have similar campaigns about “don’t California my state” and by “California” they mean don’t bring your “liberal/socialist/Communist/woke/progressive/democratic” outlook to their states, because they don’t want to be responsible for cleaning up the racism and various other problems that the red states seem to have adopted as their identities.

This also happens to a lesser degree with "the nearest large & fairly progressive city" I grew up in Madison, WI, fell in love with a girl from a small town across the state and we moved in together, got married started a family etc. So the dogwhistling that happens when you talk about the nearest liberal big city is real. I'm selective about who I tell that I grew up in Madison, and I listen for the obvious dogwhistling like "oh I try to avoid Madison as much as possible" "oh I really don't like Madison"

And now that trumpian politics have had a chance to really take hold we're planning on moving to a larger city, in part because we dont want our kids growing up around so much racism. When local online communities, local organizations and local community meeting places (aka the local bars) are riddled with dogwhistley comments because people feel comfortable saying them (which wasn't so bad just a few years ago!) It's just not pleasant

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[-] reverendsteveii@lemm.ee 140 points 1 year ago

California gets trotted out in the conservative media sphere as "liberalism run wild", a place where being what they consider to be a "real American" is illegal but crime is subsidized by the state, where everything is expensive and dangerous, and homeless people have gay sex in the street. There's an entire industry focused on filtering for the most extremely awful news they can find in a state of almost 40 million people, packaging that news as though it's the typical experience everyone there goes through, and then blasting that news into the brains of Americans 24/7. That image, carefully crafted to be as extremely negative as possible, is the only experience most people have with California.

[-] BaconIsAVeg@lemmy.ml 38 points 1 year ago

I moved from Canada to California a few years ago and spent almost 5 years in the San Jose area. Loved California; the food, the people there, the scenery, definitely the weather. End up hating America though.

[-] some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org 18 points 1 year ago

I live in the Bay Area and love all the natural beauty in all directions. We can hike a different trail every weekend during the months when it's not unpleasantly warm or chilly and never repeat. The tragedy of it all is that it's attached to the rest of the country, by which I mean red states.

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[-] arcrust@lemmy.ml 25 points 1 year ago

The liberalism run wild concept is kinda what I'm curious about. Like what things? I know California protects abortions and has stronger gun control laws. But is that really it? There's gotta be more actual examples

[-] ChronosWing@lemmy.zip 44 points 1 year ago

A lot of social programs, better employee pay and benefits, legal weed. Conservatives are just jealous that their shithole backwater hick towns will never change so they point at the scary liberal boogeyman that is "Commiefornia" in some vain hope they will get noticed.

[-] some_guy@lemmy.sdf.org 22 points 1 year ago
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[-] ComradePorkRoll@lemmy.ml 35 points 1 year ago

Nope. Conservatives are a simple people. You tell them something is bad because god doesn't like it and they won't question it.

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[-] ZzyzxRoad@lemm.ee 18 points 1 year ago

That image, carefully crafted to be as extremely negative as possible, is the only experience most people have with California.

That's the thing. No one I've ever heard who says this kind of shit has ever lived here for any length of time or knows anything about the state beyond what the "news" has told them to believe. There are issues here like there are issues everywhere. So people want to focus on homelessness. Of course we have more homeless people, we have more people. We have two of the largest and most well known metro areas in the nation with an up and coming third.

The bitching takes away (maybe intentionally) from the homeless issue that is rapidly increasing throughout the rest of the country. This is an issue of inflation and greed masquerading as inflation. Of corporate property owners buying up rentals and raising rents. Of workers not being paid a living wage. Of food and essentials becoming increasingly unaffordable by the month. Of course people are losing their homes and stealing from walmart. But this is a national problem. It gets worse all over the country for the same reasons and at the same time that it gets worse in California.

But what I will say is, we do have reproductive rights. Reasonable firearms regulations. More tenant regulations that most places, though still never enough. Some cities have social worker response teams instead of sending cops to kill people having mental health problems. We have homeless outreach and a statewide homeless census. Our schools and colleges still have diversity programs and sex ed. The state provides tuition waivers and grants for low income and marginalized students. We have drag shows and pride parades. And our libraries aren't being purged by fucking nazis. So there's that.

[-] JackbyDev@programming.dev 128 points 1 year ago

California is the target of conservative fear mongering.

[-] SeaJ@lemm.ee 32 points 1 year ago

Which is silly considering how many conservatives there are there. The current speaker of the House is from California.

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[-] Kolanaki@yiffit.net 87 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

It's a left-leaning, progressive state. Everyone who talks shit about this state in anything other than the cost of living generally doesn't have an answer because their actual reason for disliking the state is that it's not a republican state.

[-] tills13@lemmy.world 34 points 1 year ago

Fwiw there are more Republicans in California than most red states it's just a matter of having an enormous population. Hence OP's coworker.

[-] zkfcfbzr@lemmy.world 21 points 1 year ago

To drive your point home: More Californians voted for Trump than Texans.

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[-] Radicalized@lemmy.one 87 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

There’s a large amount of perceived haughtiness from the residents of California. They have a lot to be proud of though - it’s a great state in a lot of regards.

Full disclosure, I’m Canadian but travel to San Diego often for work.

Downtown San Diego is not as I remember it from before the pandemic. It’s quite clear to me that California is struggling with a massive mental health and addiction issue. The cost of living compounds these issues and amplifies the worst in people. Even “normal” working class folk are quick to anger and explode at the slightest inconvenience and people just do not give a shit about each other. I pin it to everyone being stressed out because they live paycheck to paycheck and the future is always uncertain.

Things that I think could help: universal healthcare, increased public housing, and the execution of the sackler family.

[-] robotrash@lemmy.robotra.sh 23 points 1 year ago

Also universal basic income

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[-] clara@feddit.uk 69 points 1 year ago

california is the largest "sub-national" economy in the world. if california was a country, it would have the fifth largest economy. bigger than the uk, or bigger than india.

if i had to guess, the answer is "success breeds jealousy"

[-] Dubious_Fart@lemmy.ml 39 points 1 year ago

If anything, it should be California thats pissed off, having all its tax money go to support the failed red states and their failed policies via the federal redistribution.

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[-] Ward@sopuli.xyz 52 points 1 year ago

I think this is mostly due to the highly polarized political climate. California is the most populous state and it's policies frequently end up spreading to other states and therefore is frequently focused on because if it's major influence. This is similar to how Texas and Florida are in the news a lot for their more conservative policies. While there are people out there who take the time to inform themselves and make their own decisions most people are only able to parrot back talking points they hear from the news or their friends. I suspect your coworker is one of those people and probably leans conservative so all he hears all day is how California's policies are making housing too expensive and it's too "woke" etc.

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[-] huginn@feddit.it 49 points 1 year ago

As a very left leaning individual who does not like California my reasons basically come down to all the benign neglect of the homeless (leaving people to rot in the streets with their fentanyl addictions isn't progressive, assholes) the militant oppositions to building housing anywhere (progress is being made but it's like pulling teeth) and the huge focus on performative laws that effect 0 actual change.

... Notably these are all problems in other states too. Most of them just use police to lock them up instead. Not better.

But California rubs me the wrong way because they act smug about it.

[-] fkn@lemmy.world 22 points 1 year ago

California also has more homeless than other states.... Reasonable weather and they don't get thrown in jail? Homeless people migrate here for those reasons.

I also wish we did a better job... It's not that California doesn't spend money on the problem... It's just the money we have spent has been ineffective. If we could get more housing first options maybe it would be better? It sucks though to go downtown sometimes.

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[-] whygohomie@reddthat.com 48 points 1 year ago

Because its a right-wing dogwhistle.

[-] uralsolo@hexbear.net 48 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

I live here and it's all propaganda. From my lefty perspective there are no shortage of things to criticize about California, but most of the criticism in the mainstream comes from the right and more or less 90% of it is made up.

Example: last year San Francisco elected a DA who said that they wanted to reform the justice department, used Black Lives Matter rhetoric, etc, and the conservative media sphere drummed up a propaganda campaign against them and against San Francisco generally that convinced everyone that a spike in crime had occurred even though there was no actual evidence that crime had gone up (and even if it had the new DA hadn't been in nearly long enough to be the cause of it). This resulted in that DA getting recalled and replaced and everyone outside the state thinking that San Francisco is Mad Max, even though statistically things are basically exactly the way they've been for the past couple of decades.

The real problems are what other people said, things are expensive and the cities have a lot of inefficient sprawl which makes the cost of living worse and starves the city governments of funds for social services. We've been staring down the barrel of a water crisis for like two decades and the state government is seemingly incapable of taking any action on it, we spend way too much money on cops, the government is completely captured by the local industries, the only thing we seem capable of doing to homeless people is systematically brutalizing them - but none of those problems are unique to California.

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[-] mycatiskai@lemmy.one 48 points 1 year ago

Funny enough for the right wingers that don't like the gun control in California, it was first brought in because Reagan was fearful of the Black Panthers who were openly carrying fully legal assault rifles and those white politicians couldn't handle that second amendment applying to black gun owners.

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[-] weinermeat@lemmy.world 47 points 1 year ago

Poor republicans are butthurt

[-] GiddyGap@lemmy.world 46 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

As California goes, so goes the nation. Conservatives don't like this.

If it wasn't for the high cost of living, I'd move to California as well. Still hope I'll make it there some day.

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[-] takeda@szmer.info 35 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

Most people out of the state who complain about California, never lived here, they are just repeating what they heard on conservative media.

If it was a hell hole like they say, the property prices would be cheap, no one would want them.

Most people that are leaving, are leaving because they got priced out and cannot afford to stay.

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[-] littlecolt@lemm.ee 28 points 1 year ago

From my small sample size experience as a customer service rep for an internet and cable TV company, California customers are some of the most obnoxious ever. People in LA seem like some of the angriest people ever. The slightest inconvenience and it's like you killed their fucking dog.

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[-] kava@lemmy.world 27 points 1 year ago

Same reason people don't like Florida. Lots of targeted negative media coverage. Conservatives think California is a shithole where homeless people are everywhere and people don't get arrested for robbing a store at gunpoint. Non-conservatives think Florida is full of hard-core Trumpers who want to ban all gay people from existing and is like a redneck 1984.

Reality is more nuanced. Both states are very large populations with a diverse makeup. But nuance is hard to convey in headlines. I personally live in Florida and love it, even though I hate DeSantis with a passion. The people here make up for the shitty politics. And the pendulum will inevitably swing back to the other side.

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[-] Blamemeta@lemm.ee 25 points 1 year ago

Right now, it's because Californians are moving to [insert right wing state] and turning it left wing.

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[-] warhammercasey@lemmy.world 22 points 1 year ago

I’m not sure how this hasn’t been mentioned yet but a lot of the Midwest doesn’t like California because it feels like there’s a migration of californians who have been priced out of California moving into the Midwest who both bring their left leaning policies into right leaning areas and buy up so much property it drives housing even higher.

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[-] rigatti@lemmy.world 21 points 1 year ago

They watch a lot of Fox Entertainment.

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[-] Lucidlethargy@sh.itjust.works 21 points 1 year ago

It's all nonsense created by right wing extremists. California is an amazing state for a huge, long list of reasons.

The people here are amazing (not you, LA) and we have some of the most beautiful beaches, coasts and forests in the world.

[-] GingeyBook@lemmy.world 20 points 1 year ago

Went to San Francisco and California in general for the first time this past May. I've grown up in the suburbs on the East Coast with a very conservative family.

They were all losing their minds when I told them I was going to go. They were convinced I was going to get 16 times a day.

The city and state as a whole was absolutely beautiful (visited Yosemite and got engaged). There was so much to do that I had never experienced as someone who grew up in the suburbs. There was only one time we felt a bit uncomfortable but we were aware of the situation and had plans to get out if need be.

We rode public transportation (the horrors!) the whole time without any problem.

I know it's not perfect by any means but to me the problem is fear mongering by the likes of Fox

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[-] Donjuanme@lemmy.world 20 points 1 year ago

While traveling in the South I was surprised to hear the exact same conversation in every diner I went into. It was whatever scare point was on the news the previous day. And nobody was debating the merits of the clams they were reciting, they were just agreeing with each other and bringing up the next claim. It was like it was a scripted conversation that they had started every time I walked into a greasy spoon restaurant.

I think it's more important for people to be up on their current talking points than to look at anything critically, especially not look into what their "news" media tells them is happening. And a lot of that seems to revolve around how terrible California is, I'm not sure why besides creating a very "large and powerful, controls Hollywood and the narrative" other for people to be worried about. (Surprisingly the exact same narrative control that dominates the diners in the South)

[-] jecxjo@midwest.social 20 points 1 year ago

From what I've observed it has to do with the fact most people do not know how to party, something California knoes how to do very well.

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[-] hbar@lemmy.ml 19 points 1 year ago

California is cool, I just don't like LA. It's dirty, crowded, has traffic 24/7, and everything is expensive just to name a few reasons.

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[-] downpunxx@kbin.social 19 points 1 year ago

Republican deflection and propaganda. Next questions.

[-] UPGRAYEDD@lemmy.world 19 points 1 year ago

Everyone is just bringing up economic reasons, but none of them are really policy directly. The economics are a good reason to hate California, but they dont have policies that really drive this. The real key is that California is a massively desirable place to live. The beaches are only second to Hawaii. The weather is arguably the best in the world. Some of the most beautiful state parks. It's one of the only places you could surf in the morning and snowboard in the afternoon. Supply is limited, and demand is high, so you get high prices.

As for actual policy, California has a progressive mindset. This leads to a lot of progressive policies. The problem tends to be that the policies that get enacted are often designed to sound progressive, but actually just limit the citizens without fixing the problem. Examples:

  1. Coal rolling was bad for the environment. So they outlawed a large amount of car tuning. This causes damage to the car culture and a good hobby for a large number of citizens.

  2. Water, being a limited resource in California, made it finable to water your lawn or wash your car in a drought, even though farming and business use 96% of total water usage. Normal people water usage isn't going to solve the problem

  3. Gun policies that dont allow suppressors, short barrel rifles, etc, but in reality, the vast majority of gun crime and accidents are all based around handguns.

I have oversimplified all of these, but essentially, California is very good at making policies that annoy their citizens, but dont solve the problem just to make it appear like they are doing something.

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[-] WIIHAPPYFEW@hexbear.net 18 points 1 year ago

Two words: Techbro Ethnocracy

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[-] peter@feddit.uk 18 points 1 year ago

Homelessness problem, too hot, too idolised and too full of rich assholes

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[-] SpyingEnvelope@lemmy.world 17 points 1 year ago

As a tourist from Canada, my wife and I drove through parts of the US for about three weeks in 2018, and we absolutely hated California. It was our least favourite part of the trip. It is clear that LA is struggling with massive homelessness. The roads were the worst ones we encountered on our road trip. The beaches were littered with garbage, to an amount that we just found disgusting. They were also incredibly overcrowded, though that is what happens in heavily populated places. We went to Disneyland, and that was nice. However, we did cut our California stay short and moved on.

Now, I don't have many places to compare California to, as we were only in about four states. However, we have travelled extensively in Canada, where we have been to most of the provinces. We enjoyed the states and provinces we have visited. However, California is definitely in our no-no zone for vacations.

Again, this is a tourist perspective. I do not really know what it's like to live there.

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this post was submitted on 06 Aug 2023
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