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this post was submitted on 07 Nov 2023
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Issue is the Hamas are not an regular military force which makes it hard to target them, they are terrorists and exclusively targeting civilians. Every death on the 7th of october is related to them in the end, because they have decided to actively engage on civilians.
This is all fine except Hamas does not exclusively target civilians. It has been only targeting military vehicles and tanks since the incursion in Gaza (not counting the rockets dropped on Israeli areas, that don't seem to be causing any casualties).
And sadly almost every death since October 7 has been caused by Israel directly killing civilians in Gaza.
We can twist the truth all we want but Hamas aren't blanket terrorists (and I quite dislike them and their dumb strategy). Let's not romanticize calling them some extrwme thing removed from details and context.
Can you provide evidence that they exclusively target civilians given the fact that they have mostly attacked armed forces since the kibbutz was taken back?
Hamas are a lot of shitty things but this claim is factually false. And because it's factually false, I can't consider it much more than propaganda.
you want evidence from me that the attacks on the 7th of october were exclusively targeted at civilians?
Read my comment again, I'm talking about AFTER that.
How about every rocket Hamas has fired towards an area that isn't a military base. That should give you several thousand data points...
So the IDF handeld a situation very badly and killed a number of civilians, the cause of all that would still be the terrorist act on civlians by the hamas. It does not alter any of the points I made earlier:
The Hamas and any other terrorist group are rabid dogs, they need to go if we ever want a free Palestine and (!) a free Israel.
What Bullshit propaganda are you on? If israel kills it's own civilians it's their fault. They can't just spray fire their tanks and machine guns into their own Kibbutzes and then blame Hamas lmao.
Israel's response to Hamas is disproportionate and careless on purpose. There is blood on many hands, but those now being starved and dying of disease and bombed hospitals is 100% Israel's action opposed by the rest of the world. Almost Every specialist, every human rights official, every person who is qualified to comment on this is saying Israel is causing civilian deaths, crossing lines, and committing collective punishment. We are not talking about a few thousands here and there that the IDF tried to protect but couldn't... We are talking about 10k deaths, 2k under the rubble. This is not collateral damage.
okay, was not the point of our discussion and I did not say otherwise but thanks for sharing it I guess...
I tend to disagree on the collective punishment point, but that's fine everybody can have his or her opinion :)
consistently moving the goalposts is one of the core hallmarks of a bad faith argument. you handled it very well!
Yeah Israel starving people is totally not like the goddamn holocaust. /s
"Opinions", how convenient it is to have them while people just die on the hands of Israel.
Okay that went very fast into holocaust relativism... no thank you, I don't want to be part of this discussion anymore, let's end it here on a polite note.
And just to make it clear, as a german I learned, "the Holocaust was a genocide during World War II in which Nazi Germany, aided by its collaborators, systematically murdered approximately 6 million European Jews" (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Holocaust) therefor I find it highly inappropriate to use this very term for the situation in the middle east or as a comparison to it.
Sorry, if Israel doesn't want holocaust relativism it should stop doing very holocausty things like starving people and killing medical patients and the medics and the journalists, god I'm out of fucking words.
"Never again" includes Palestinians. If it doesn't today, then it's not living up to its meaning.
or maybe you just should stop holocaust relativism 🤷♂️
Maybe you shouldnt sympathize with Nazi's. Did they teach you Germans nothing in school?
or maybe Israel just should stop repeating the holocaust on another group of people.
being shitty and inflammatory is really gonna convince people you’re on the side that cares
Look buddy, if you can't see that this collective punishment and against international law then I can't help you.
Buddy, if you can’t proofread a single sentence comment then I don’t know that I want your help.
Meh