626
submitted 10 months ago by Silverseren@kbin.social to c/world@lemmy.world

A German foundation has said it will no longer be awarding a prize for political thinking to a leading Russian-American journalist after criticizing as “unacceptable” a recent essay by the writer in which they made a comparison between Gaza and a Jewish ghetto in Nazi-occupied Europe.

top 50 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[-] Silverseren@kbin.social 260 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

The hypocrisy of the Heinrich Böll Foundation (and the German government in general) is incredible.

Here you have a Jewish person who is a journalist and a renowned political thinker who was being given the award for being someone who "reports on power games and totalitarian tendencies as well as civil disobedience and the love of freedom".

They 100% have the position, right, and accuracy to be comparing the state of Gaza currently to the WWII ghettos.

Edit: Something else to note. The Foundation made this statement ""But Masha Gessen's views should not be honored with a prize intended to commemorate the Jewish philosopher Hannah Arendt".

And I can't help but laugh. Do they not know Arendt's past stance on Israel? She was literally one of the first world-renowned Jewish anti-Zionists.

She literally compared the Likud party to the Nazis!

[-] jonne@infosec.pub 66 points 10 months ago

This is the real, actual cancel culture, and usual suspects are silent, as expected.

[-] febra@lemmy.world 35 points 10 months ago

Do they not know Arendt’s past stance on Israel?

Partly jewish, German citizen here. I'll answer this for you. No, they don't. They never worked out their own history. It's all just teathre.

[-] ShroOmeric@lemmy.world 15 points 10 months ago

Hannah Arendt would be punished as antisemite in today Germany. What a cesspool that country is becoming once again.

[-] detalferous@lemm.ee 8 points 10 months ago

That is incredible

load more comments (2 replies)
[-] reverendsteveii@lemm.ee 160 points 10 months ago

Hannah Arendt prize for political thought

Genocide Expert Award Rescinded After Genocide Expert Compares Genocide To Genocide

[-] Maggoty@lemmy.world 104 points 10 months ago

Huh, the IDF is currently pushing Gazans into smaller and smaller areas by not allowing them to evacuate through their lines and forcibly removing civilians who didn't evacuate.

They also plan to maintain the blockade they've had on the strip that heavily restricts people and material from moving.

What historical parallel could there possibly be to this situation?

Oh well. Better not listen to the guy who studied it hard enough to earn the award in the first place.

[-] julianschmulian@lemmy.blahaj.zone 74 points 10 months ago

I‘m German, currently living in Switzerland and when I recently visited Germany I was appalled by the amount of unconditional support for Israel, for example a HUGE (maybe 10x10m?) israeli flag on the offices of the Grünen party and official posters calling for solidarity. I don‘t even think this is stemming from (however undifferentiated and misguided) historical considerations, rather than geopolitical considerations. Also on the subject of the article, I think that‘s a pretty apt and carefully done comparison.

[-] sukhmel@programming.dev 32 points 10 months ago

I feel this really is because of plucking the historical guilt strings and "if you're against Israel's actions you're an anti-semit"

But I am not in the know of the local German situation, so might as well be a wrong impression

[-] pufferfischerpulver@feddit.de 11 points 10 months ago

Pretty much. It's incredibly tiring

[-] Facebones@reddthat.com 20 points 10 months ago

As just some asshole in America, the fierce blind support here seems to come from one of two places:

1- good old racism. just like the Irish, Italian, etc before them, jews have their "white card" with the bigots especially when the "enemy" are darker.

2- Religious nuts who think war around the holy land = the second coming and are going to root for anybody who keeps the war flowing.

load more comments (1 replies)
[-] Caligvla@lemmy.dbzer0.com 60 points 10 months ago

I wonder if in 100 years we'll be looking at Israel like we look at Nazi Germany nowadays.

[-] SattaRIP@kbin.social 45 points 10 months ago

Well, if history is indeed cyclical, then in a 100 years Palestinians will have their own ethnostate and oppressing a different peoples. My guess is Kurds. /s

load more comments (4 replies)
[-] Maggoty@lemmy.world 18 points 10 months ago

In a couple decades we'll pass a non binding resolution condemning the genocide of Gaza and pat ourselves on the back for doing the right thing. Then we'll pass another military aid package for Greater Israel.

[-] jack@monero.town 14 points 10 months ago

The difference is that this time USA supports the fascists

[-] blanketswithsmallpox@kbin.social 19 points 10 months ago

This time?

America supports whoever we think will benefit us the most geopolitically lol. Israel is a centerpiece in the MENA which can't really be ignored for how much pressure they put on their neighbors.

load more comments (1 replies)
[-] deadbeef79000@lemmy.nz 9 points 10 months ago

I've got some bad news.

The US was fully prepared to support the Nazis right up until it looked like they'd probably lose the war.

[-] Kbobabob@lemmy.world 12 points 10 months ago

Do you have a source for that? I tried searching but didn't seem to find what you're referring to.

[-] archomrade@midwest.social 12 points 10 months ago

I think they're talking about American Nazi party involvement in the 1930's (sources in the comment below the question) at the time leading up to America's involvement, not necessarily official American foreign policy.

it's certainly an interesting revisionist question (i.e. if America had been on the axis side of the war), but it's definitely a-historical.

load more comments (2 replies)
load more comments (13 replies)
[-] veganpizza69@lemmy.world 13 points 10 months ago

100 years from now the MENA region will be uninhabitable due to climate heating and I doubt that anyone will want to visit it in some spacesuit.

[-] Meowoem@sh.itjust.works 6 points 10 months ago

That's not what any of the worst case scenario in climate studies I've seen seem to think, what are you basing it on?

load more comments (10 replies)
load more comments (1 replies)
[-] Limitless_screaming@kbin.social 7 points 10 months ago

If they end up losing.

[-] jimmydoreisalefty@lemmy.world 57 points 10 months ago

According to the German newspaper Die Zeit, which broke the story, the prize will still be presented to Gessen, though “in a different setting”, and on Saturday instead of Friday. It remains unclear who will present it, what they will be presenting and whether Gessen and other invited guests still plan to attend.

In the paragraph the HBS draws attention to, Gessen wrote that “ghetto” would be “the more appropriate term” to describe Gaza, but the word “would have drawn fire for comparing the predicament of besieged Gazans to that of ghettoized Jews. It also would have given us the language to describe what is happening in Gaza now. The ghetto is being liquidated.”

On X/Twitter, they wrote that no German media representative had tried to contact them, despite the story being widely reported in German media on Thursday.

Supporters of Gessen, who is Jewish, and whose grandfather and great-grandfather were among family members murdered by the Nazis, have been quick to point out the irony of suspending a prize awarded in memory of Arendt, the German-born Jewish-American historian, philosopher and antitotalitarian political theorist who coined the phrase “the banality of evil”, in connection with the trial of leading Nazi Adolf Eichmann, which she covered as a journalist for the New Yorker.

In an open letter written with Albert Einstein and other Jewish intellectuals in 1948, Arendt had, Gessen pointed out, even compared the Israeli Freedom party to the Nazis after they used racially motivated violence against civilians.

“I am aware that this type of comparison, especially in Germany, is quickly seen as relativising the Holocaust. That’s why it’s so important to me that such a differentiated and intelligent thinker like Arendt didn’t shy away from this comparison,” Gessen told the newspaper.

Referring to people in Germany being wary of challenging “the logic of German memory policy” for fear of being accused of antisemitism, they added: “The problem is that criticism of Israel is often seen as antisemitic, which I think is the real antisemitic scandal. This overlooks the actual antisemitism.”

[-] FuglyDuck@lemmy.world 24 points 10 months ago

for those wanting to read the letter to the editor of NYT signed by Einstein and Arendt

Keep in mind Tnaut Harerut is the literal precursor to Likud. And was a political offshoot of the paramilitary that attacked both the British and the Palistinian groups because they didn’t like the idea of sharing power with palistinians.

[-] Silverseren@kbin.social 12 points 10 months ago

Good timing, I was literally editing my original comment to note that when you posted at the same time!

[-] jimmydoreisalefty@lemmy.world 8 points 10 months ago

Thank you!

Great minds think alike, hahaha

[-] UnfortunateShort@lemmy.world 44 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

On the bright side I really appreciate how many people speak out against Israel. I feel like their government has finally abused the "you're either for us or antisemitic" card enough for people to stop caring about that bs.

Truth is that government never really wanted peace and many Israeli didn't either. Not that Hamas is any better. The point is there are no good guys here. Just idiots and criminals and civilians who are being slaughtered because of the former.

[-] dangblingus@lemmy.dbzer0.com 14 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

This time, with social media's pervasiveness, the pro-Israel propaganda is tissue paper thin. People are absolutely coming to grips with the fact that Israel is engaging in broad daylight ethnic cleansing and genocide.

[-] TheDoozer@lemmy.world 13 points 10 months ago

Not that Hamas is any better. The point is there are no good guys here.

True. But if you saw a 20-year-old asshole beating the shit out of a 10-year-old asshole (even if the 10-year-old started it), you wouldn't hand the 20-year-old a bat.

[-] lunarul@lemmy.world 7 points 10 months ago

The 10 year old didn't even start it. His big brother started it, then retreated safely home to watch the 10 year old get pummeled. When someone finally intervenes and stops the fighting, the big brother will come out and sucker punch the 20 year old again, leaving the 10 year old to deal with the consequences. Again.

load more comments (3 replies)
[-] dangblingus@lemmy.dbzer0.com 42 points 10 months ago

It's very very much like the Polish ghettos. You tell me, did Jews in Warsaw get put into an open air prison? Did Jews in Warsaw have their food and water and electricity taken away? Were the Jews in Warsaw allowed to leave the ghetto? Were the ghettos bombed and terrorized by Nazis?

[-] AshMan85@lemmy.world 41 points 10 months ago

100% accurate

[-] not_that_guy05@lemmy.world 20 points 10 months ago

Honestly what timeline are we on. I wonder if they've even asked themselves "are we the baddies?".

[-] lennybird@lemmy.world 20 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago)

He's not wrong. Been saying this since week 1 of this new stage of the conflict. Others have been saying this for decades.

[-] ShroOmeric@lemmy.world 15 points 10 months ago

Germans learned nothing from their Nazi past. Still love censorship and still love to consider some lives more important than others. They'te just acting like an Israel's colony now.

[-] Holyhandgrenade@lemmy.world 72 points 10 months ago

I think Germany has actually accepted a lot more responsibility for the atrocities they've committed, compared to nearly every other European nation guilty of colonialism and genocide. I have British friends who were taught almost nothing about Britain's colonial past in school, while every German has to learn about the Holocaust in school.
In a way I understand Germany's reluctance to compare a Jewish ethnostate to Nazism, considering what they did to the Jews 80 years ago. But I think that comparison is completely justified and Germany should know better. Israel is an apartheid state, and Netanyahu is one Auschwitz away from being just like Hitler.

[-] ShroOmeric@lemmy.world 20 points 10 months ago

They did accept responsability, but in itself has no value if they cannot raise their voices against another genocide that is happening right now. Totally agree with the res you say.

[-] lolcatnip@reddthat.com 7 points 10 months ago

It still has value if it stops then from committing another genocide themselves. But yeah, they could be doing a lot better.

load more comments (1 replies)
[-] Holyhandgrenade@lemmy.world 6 points 10 months ago

Yeah I completely agree. They know better than anyone what fascism looks like, and the fact that they choose to do nothing is sickening.

load more comments (1 replies)
[-] autotldr 6 points 10 months ago

This is the best summary I could come up with:


A German foundation has said it will no longer be awarding a prize for political thinking to a leading Russian-American journalist after criticising as “unacceptable” a recent essay by the writer in which they made a comparison between Gaza and a Jewish ghetto in Nazi-occupied Europe.

In the paragraph the HBS draws attention to, Gessen wrote that “ghetto” would be “the more appropriate term” to describe Gaza, but the word “would have drawn fire for comparing the predicament of besieged Gazans to that of ghettoized Jews.

At the time it stated that “as an analyst of decline and hope, Gessen reports on power games and totalitarian tendencies as well as civil disobedience and the love of freedom”.

Supporters of Gessen, who is Jewish, and whose grandfather and great-grandfather were among family members murdered by the Nazis, have been quick to point out the irony of suspending a prize awarded in memory of Arendt, the German-born Jewish-American historian, philosopher and antitotalitarian political theorist who coined the phrase “the banality of evil”, in connection with the trial of leading Nazi Adolf Eichmann, which she covered as a journalist for the New Yorker.

In an interview with Die Zeit published on Tuesday, Gessen spoke of the backlash Arendt had faced as one of Israel’s initial critics, warning against establishing a purely Jewish state in Palestine and in so doing excluding the Arab population.

In an open letter written with Albert Einstein and other Jewish intellectuals in 1948, Arendt had, Gessen pointed out, even compared the Israeli Freedom party to the Nazis after they used racially motivated violence against civilians.


The original article contains 760 words, the summary contains 266 words. Saved 65%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!

load more comments
view more: next ›
this post was submitted on 15 Dec 2023
626 points (97.0% liked)

World News

38977 readers
2940 users here now

A community for discussing events around the World

Rules:

Similarly, if you see posts along these lines, do not engage. Report them, block them, and live a happier life than they do. We see too many slapfights that boil down to "Mom! He's bugging me!" and "I'm not touching you!" Going forward, slapfights will result in removed comments and temp bans to cool off.

We ask that the users report any comment or post that violate the rules, to use critical thinking when reading, posting or commenting. Users that post off-topic spam, advocate violence, have multiple comments or posts removed, weaponize reports or violate the code of conduct will be banned.

All posts and comments will be reviewed on a case-by-case basis. This means that some content that violates the rules may be allowed, while other content that does not violate the rules may be removed. The moderators retain the right to remove any content and ban users.


Lemmy World Partners

News !news@lemmy.world

Politics !politics@lemmy.world

World Politics !globalpolitics@lemmy.world


Recommendations

For Firefox users, there is media bias / propaganda / fact check plugin.

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/media-bias-fact-check/

founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS